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Tuning
Nov 26, 2013 10:41:58 GMT
Post by colan on Nov 26, 2013 10:41:58 GMT
18 different tunings in seconds ( Temporal, that is ) www.tronical.com/All the right-hand work is done by a caged chicken. No link available.
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leoroberts
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My main instrument is: probably needing new strings
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Tuning
Nov 26, 2013 11:06:53 GMT
Post by leoroberts on Nov 26, 2013 11:06:53 GMT
I always thought it was so simple... apparently, it isn't...
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ocarolan
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Tuning
Nov 26, 2013 11:44:42 GMT
Post by ocarolan on Nov 26, 2013 11:44:42 GMT
Just love JT! He does talk a fair bit of sense in this vid, but not everything he says is a universal truth in the quantitive sense - it applies to him/his playing technique/his guitar/his capo/his setup/his strings - don't think this is a magic formula that would work for everyone. If he used a decent capo, and had his guitar set up to better compensate especially the sixth string, then his detunes would be different. The amounts he tunes down are, for the most part, not detectable by ear, but they do make a difference to how "in tune" the guitar sounds when being played and several strings are going at once - the overtones are more in tune. He has, though, quantified (for his particular situation) what most guitarists do anyway - "sweeten" their tuning, especially with respect to the second and sixth strings. Many often check by playing specific "difficult" combinations of notes/positions/chord inversions that they know are critical on their guitar/for a particular piece/in a particular capo position. There's never going to be a perfectly tuned guitar anyway (it's inherent in the compromises of fretting and the unalterable physical properties of vibrating strings), especially when playing with other (especially fixed pitch) instruments, but we can strive to spread the out of tuneness across all the notes/keys so it is less noticeable! Interesting vid Leo! Keith
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leoroberts
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My main instrument is: probably needing new strings
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Post by leoroberts on Nov 26, 2013 12:25:13 GMT
aye, that's the problem with them Olson guitars - just don't stay in tune. I suppose you get what you pay for
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Tuning
Nov 26, 2013 22:22:09 GMT
Post by K Tresp on Nov 26, 2013 22:22:09 GMT
Tuners are ok when there is a lot of background noise but if you cant hear the notes accurately when you are tuning how can you do it when you are playing? Trust your ears. Keith raises an interesting point on sweetened tunings and that there is no such thing as a perfect tuning. Apparently Peterson do a tuner which tries to address this. Has anyone tried them? www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=14&sub=90
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missclarktree
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Post by missclarktree on Nov 27, 2013 13:36:05 GMT
There's never going to be a perfectly tuned guitar anyway (it's inherent in the compromises of fretting and the unalterable physical properties of vibrating strings), especially when playing with other (especially fixed pitch) instruments, but we can strive to spread the out of tuneness across all the notes/keys so it is less noticeable! Interesting vid Leo! Keith It seems there's more to tuning than meets the ear. It reminds of trying to use a spirit level in a house like mine where none of the walls, floors or radiators are straight. Sometimes it's down to rack of eye an' angle o' t' gob (as Fred Dibnah should have said).
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Tuning
Nov 27, 2013 14:05:49 GMT
Post by colan on Nov 27, 2013 14:05:49 GMT
Tuners are ok when there is a lot of background noise but if you cant hear the notes accurately when you are tuning how can you do it when you are playing? Trust your ears. Keith raises an interesting point on sweetened tunings and that there is no such thing as a perfect tuning. Apparently Peterson do a tuner which tries to address this. Has anyone tried them? www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=14&sub=90 All my tuners- and I have several different makes- operate by microphone as an option. Their most efficient mode is when they're clipped on to tune by vibration. Playing in different keys requires retuning certain strings . Guitar tuning must be ' tempered ', just like a piano.
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Tuning
Dec 5, 2013 11:29:53 GMT
Post by slasher on Dec 5, 2013 11:29:53 GMT
I have always found tuning difficult, "tin ear syndrome"! I can get there eventually though. My main guitar, a Moon 0003 tends to stay in tune with itself for long periods. I check it with a clip-on at sessions. Clip-ons are brilliant for large sessions as everyone can be in tune together very quickly.
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ocarolan
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Post by ocarolan on Dec 5, 2013 11:40:45 GMT
........ Clip-ons are brilliant for large sessions as everyone can be in tune together very quickly. ...unless your melodeon/accordian/concertina players instruments are a bit off pitch ... Keith
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Post by slasher on Dec 6, 2013 12:26:38 GMT
Yes too true, at one session I attend there is a hammered dulcimer. Now that takes a lot of tuning, but it does tend to stay in tune for quite a while once "in". My melodeon is in tune, and I have a pal who plays piano accordian who is a real pro and his instruments are spot on. Ah,those horrible situations where someone seems not to realize quite how far "out" they are and plough-on regardless with a tune while everyone else gradually ceases playing!
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Tuning
Dec 27, 2013 11:48:13 GMT
Post by arturo on Dec 27, 2013 11:48:13 GMT
Just looked at the "Tronical" link. It looks just like the gizmo Gibson offer as a option on their electrics. I tried one and it was brilliant at retuning but the most fun was watching the tuner buttons rotate as it did it. Stores common open tunings too but I can't help agreeing with Keith that learning by ear is better for the soul.
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Tuning
Dec 27, 2013 11:57:43 GMT
Post by arturo on Dec 27, 2013 11:57:43 GMT
And I also noticed on the JT video that he reaches pitch by tuning down to the note as well as up to it, depending. If you tune flat and always go up to pitch, you won't have the mechanical slack in the machines to deal with as the string tension will take out the movement in the gears on the way.
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Post by shadywilbury on Dec 29, 2013 18:54:45 GMT
Everything is beginning to rely on smartphones. What about those of us who don't use them? I like the idea of being able to get to alternative tunings quickly and easily (but am repulsed by Gibson's 'Robot' abomination...) Interesting idea, but a real stinker for a certain percentage of the guitar playing/non-smartphone owning public.
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Tuning
Dec 30, 2013 11:08:11 GMT
Post by andyhowell on Dec 30, 2013 11:08:11 GMT
There are a lot of familiar things here! You can the train your ears pretty well — whenever you use a tuner try and make sure you listen to what is happening to the note at the same time as you are looking at the display.
I find that I can make a decent fist of tuning to D most times although when I'm tired sometimes it is more difficult. From this D approximation I can then tune the other strings relative to this and then fine tune by listening. Those tuners which clip on to the headstock really have made it easier to tune and make it so there are no real excuses for being massively out of tune!
I think it is true that it is easier to tune from flat up than it is to tune down from a sharp note. I often wind my tuners down so to tune up in this way. Also, a lot of people seem to naturally pitch sharp. Listen to how the note changes as while tuning with a tuner — get to recognise the subtle shift in tone and resonance as the string comes into tune.
One tuned using a tuner I will often simply listen to a simple chord using a lot of open strings. Often I find that one or other of higher strings is out quite a little. I will retune using just my ears until it sounds right. It is amazing how often a tuner will display something that just doesn't sound right! If this is happening to you it is probably not the fault of the tuner you are using — this can happen to everything.
Another thing about capos.
Slap a capo on the neck and you will often sharpen the bass strings significantly — this can happen to any strings but the 4th and 5th are particularly susceptible to this. When changing a tuning I will remove the cap and tune. I will then place the cap on and check the tuning on the bass strings and adjust accordingly. If you see a guitarist putting on a capo without checking tuning it is time to leave the room :-)
When using open tunings or Dropped D I always tune the 6th string (lowest) by ear — there is so much resonance going on here that tuners never seem to hit the spot to me. although using a harmonic on the 12th fret will give you a clearer and less resonant note.
Probably the best thing you can do to help recognise an in tune note is to make sure your guitar is retuned very regularly, i.e. checked in between each tune and song. Familiarity with a properly pitched note is key!
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davewhite
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Post by davewhite on Dec 30, 2013 11:24:40 GMT
Another thing about capos. Slap a capo on the neck and you will often sharpen the bass strings significantly — this can happen to any strings but the 4th and 5th are particularly susceptible to this. When changing a tuning I will remove the cap and tune. I will then place the cap on and check the tuning on the bass strings and adjust accordingly. If you see a guitarist putting on a capo without checking tuning it is time to leave the room :-) Depends on which guitar they are playing. A lot of that is because most guitar makers don't put enough slant on the saddle and the lower strings are too short. As you shorten scale length you need more compensation length for the lower wound strings and putting the capo on shortens scale length. Your ear doesn't hear/notice slightly flat notes but hears sharp ones so by putting extra compensation in the saddle angle with the open strings they intonate slightly flat (which your ear won't notice) but when you tune down or Capo up then this "extra" intonation gets used and the lower strings don't sound sharp. Having the neck at a constant depth rather than getting deeper nearer to the heel helps with Capoing with Shubb type capos too as the Capo pressure is constant and doesn't increase as you Capo up the neck which can pull strings sharp and require loosening the Capo.
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