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Post by vikingblues on Sept 30, 2016 12:05:36 GMT
Thanks for this. I recently discovered DADGAD so this has been great for me. I ve just got a couple of quick questions if you don't mind? When you play the G chord at the first position ( 5 fret ) , are you just fretting the G on the low D string and no other notes? I can't quite see on the video. Also I m use to playing scales in box patterns , in standard tuning . Is it done more linear in DADGAD .? Apologise if these are stupid questions but I m still trying to get my head round this . Thanks again for the video. A variation on the G chord in DADGAD that I like up at the 5th fret is a Gadd2 chord From bass to treble it's frets 5 5 0 4 0 0 G D D B A D Becomes pure G if the 5th fret on the 2nd string is also used. 5 5 0 4 5 0. The A being replaced with another G. If you're exploring altered tuning and looking at chords and possible chords I recommend the 'Guitarator Toolbox'. It has a range of built in tunings and will accept customised tunings too, it will give you prssible shapes when asked for a particular chord, and will also tell you what chord you have when you tell it which frets you are using. It also shows scale notes on the fretboard in any tuning. Guitarator.comMark
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 30, 2016 12:21:58 GMT
Thanks for this. I recently discovered DADGAD so this has been great for me. I ve just got a couple of quick questions if you don't mind? When you play the G chord at the first position ( 5 fret ) , are you just fretting the G on the low D string and no other notes? I can't quite see on the video. Also I m use to playing scales in box patterns , in standard tuning . Is it done more linear in DADGAD .? Apologise if these are stupid questions but I m still trying to get my head round this . Thanks again for the video. A very good question birdo. The answer is it depends :-) If I play the G running up the neck (as you would in Dropped D) I often fret the 3rd string at the fourth fret, as you would in Dropped D. These are exactly the same intervals as Dropped D. This gives you a more conventional sound particularly if you focus on the 4 bass strings. Sometimes things sound best leaving that string open — this is the open fourth which gives DADGAD much of its flavour. You can give DADGAD as D sus 4 tuning. When playing in my DADGAD first position the G is still fretted at 5 but using the index finger. Often I'm leaving the 3rd string open as I know definately want that celtic sound of the open strings. With this starting position you are really looking for a scale run ending either back at G or resolving down to D at the top of the fingerboard. I might do another quick video to emphasise the different alternatives you have with this tuning. Aside from the celtic stuff, I would use DADGAD for any vocal accompaniment that you might use Open D for. This style relies on the bass strings more and can give some great little runs up and down the fretboard. If you know Clive Gregson's work he does this a lot — and it is easy to sound like him :-) You can also play blues in this as well, surprisingly easily when you play around. For those of you at Halifax my Plucky Dip song 'Trying to Get Back to You' was in DADGAD (Capo 2) — as was the Peabody Blues which I sang in the Circle of Death. Those of you who went to bed early missed ,pre great harmonica playing on this from Berndt. The Peabody Blues is on the Plucky Dip somewhere. I use it to play a kind of half blues — I like what the sus 4 feel does. It kind of adds a minor complexity to it all. You might want to also experiment with this other tunings — C sus 4 sus 9 — CGCFCD. On the bass strings this has the same intervals as DADGAD but in C obviously. Then you have a 1st and a 2nd at the end. I find it almost easy to transcribe anything from DADGAD to this. This tuning is great when playing against singing and wonderful when standing up. I sing a lot in D and I would use this rather than DADGAD with the Capo at Fret II. The tuning is more neutral and the use of the capo effectively shortens the length of the fingerboard and makes things more comfortable. I thought I might do another video on C sus 2 not least as davewhite has posted a lot of theory stuff here already. Whereas DADGAD sounds celtic like C sus 2 sounds very English to me. It was used a lot by Nick Jones and Martin Simpson and Chris Wood both use it a lot. C sus 2 is only one note away from C sus 4 sus 9 — the 3rd string is now a 5th rather than a fourth. But as Martin Simpson said to me once — one note can move mountains. Some tunes I can play in both C tunings but other resist! However, I can always go from C sus 4 sus 9 to DADGAD. I'm happy to try and illustrate these two C tunings if anybody wants. SaveSave
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 30, 2016 12:26:23 GMT
From bass to treble it's frets 5 5 0 4 0 0 G D D B A D Becomes pure G if the 5th fret on the 2nd string is also used. 5 5 0 4 5 0. The A being replaced with another G. If you're exploring altered tuning and looking at chords and possible chords I recommend the 'Guitarator Toolbox'. It has a range of built in tunings and will accept customised tunings too, it will give you prssible shapes when asked for a particular chord, and will also tell you what chord you have when you tell it which frets you are using. It also shows scale notes on the fretboard in any tuning. Guitarator.comYep, and you will find this very commonly used when strumming DADGAD (I was thinking fingerstyle and simplicity for my video purposes). The main point is to anchor the chord on the bass and to play around with different options. You will be amazed by what you find and if you're as intrepid as Mark you might even be curious about the name :-) I use Guitar Toolkit on IOS. Like Guitarator this will give you all the chord shapes for a whole number of tunings. I seldom use this as it soon gets too complicated for me but it is good to have the option if you are trying to do something different, effect a key change and so on (although key changes are so cliched and so yesterday). SaveSave
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Post by fatfingerjohn on Sept 30, 2016 12:29:46 GMT
I'm happy to try and illustrate these two C tunings if anybody wants. SaveSaveHi Andy,
I looked closely at Csus2 after Dave's original thread was regenerated earlier this year and seem to remember this was one of your go-tos. I certainly would be interested in having more thoughts on this from you on video )or just plain text as long as a basic player like me can follow it.
Regards
John
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 30, 2016 12:44:33 GMT
I looked closely at Csus2 after Dave's original thread was regenerated earlier this year and seem to remember this was one of your go-tos. I certainly would be interested in having more thoughts on this from you on video )or just plain text as long as a basic player like me can follow it.
Regards
John
OK I'll have a go. Dave's piece is about as comprehensive as you need. In many ways I think of C sus 2 as my standard tuning. I love it although as I'm mostly singing these days I use the sus 4 sus 9 variant more often. I think each of these tunings have their own personality and I've not seen anyone really address this. C sus 2 is (as I hinted on the video) quite a compact tunings and in many ways easy to use. It is more 'major' and more fundamental. It is great for rhythmic fingerstyle in an English traditional way. But for me this really shines when arranging version of vocal tunes, especially local only tradition. I don't know why but it seems to mimic the human voice well. I'll try and demonstrate this but it may take a week or so !!! SaveSave
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Post by vikingblues on Sept 30, 2016 13:00:29 GMT
I'm happy to try and illustrate these two C tunings if anybody wants. SaveSaveI'd certainly be more than happy to see videos on the C tunings. There's much fewer helpful videos on these tunings than there is on DADGAD and I find videos a much better way of my picking up the essence of tunings than using books. That is when the videos are done well .... like your DADGAD one is, Andy. I've found a great deal of value in the sort of videos Martin Simpson does on altered tunings - he seems to concentrate on giving out general guidelines and the knowledge needed to allow the pupil to explore for themselves. I found your DADGAD video to be of that ilk. (If 'ilk' is the word I'm after)! The main point is to anchor the chord on the bass and to play around with different options. You will be amazed by what you find Where the chord (or variation of the chord) has notes that coincide with having D A and G the permutations are great and the range of voicings add a lot to a piece. The couch is the best place to learn though, but sometimes a few ideas formulated in advance from something like the guitarator in advance cab help the creative ideas flow. Mark
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leoroberts
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Post by leoroberts on Sept 30, 2016 15:05:06 GMT
(although key changes are so cliched and so yesterday). And THAT'S why you got chucked out of the boy band
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Post by fatfingerjohn on Sept 30, 2016 15:44:15 GMT
I looked closely at Csus2 after Dave's original thread was regenerated earlier this year and seem to remember this was one of your go-tos. I certainly would be interested in having more thoughts on this from you on video )or just plain text as long as a basic player like me can follow it.
Regards
John
OK I'll have a go. Dave's piece is about as comprehensive as you need. In many ways I think of C sus 2 as my standard tuning. I love it although as I'm mostly singing these days I use the sus 4 sus 9 variant more often. I think each of these tunings have their own personality and I've not seen anyone really address this. C sus 2 is (as I hinted on the video) quite a compact tunings and in many ways easy to use. It is more 'major' and more fundamental. It is great for rhythmic fingerstyle in an English traditional way. But for me this really shines when arranging version of vocal tunes, especially local only tradition. I don't know why but it seems to mimic the human voice well. I'll try and demonstrate this but it may take a week or so !!! SaveSaveThanks Andy. Dave's text was brilliant and just what was needed to find my around initially with a few chord shapes and ideas. But they say a picture = 1000 words? Ideally therefore if you could just show a few bars of different styles in the tuning with either a melody or an accompaniment; doesn't need much words or vocals at all but more a visual demonstration of what the tuning can do (preferably slowly)!. That would be excellent to give me some shape to move on from!
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 30, 2016 16:35:41 GMT
Thanks Andy. Dave's text was brilliant and just what was needed to find my around initially with a few chord shapes and ideas. But they say a picture = 1000 words? Ideally therefore if you could just show a few bars of different styles in the tuning with either a melody or an accompaniment; doesn't need much words or vocals at all but more a visual demonstration of what the tuning can do (preferably slowly)!. That would be excellent to give me some shape to move on from! Ok I've worked out a format, a little different to the DADGAD one. I'll look at the styles of three English guitarists and how they use this. Then I will show how I often use it to make arrangements of vocal pieces. Then we'll look at some strong basic chord shapes and some top string scales and shapes — different to DADGAD. For me this is a very English tuning. It is rarely played in clawhammer style and is often all about the rhythm in the right hand. That should cover most of what you want! SaveSave
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 30, 2016 16:36:16 GMT
(although key changes are so cliched and so yesterday). And THAT'S why you got chucked out of the boy band Like it :-) SaveSave
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Andy P
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Post by Andy P on Oct 1, 2016 10:04:13 GMT
An excellent tutorial Andy. I've been really getting into DADGAD recently. The more I use it the more rewards it gives me.
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 1, 2016 13:18:40 GMT
An excellent tutorial Andy. I've been really getting into DADGAD recently. The more I use it the more rewards it gives me. I think that's right. You begin to felel comfortable with it!
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leitrimnick
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Post by leitrimnick on Oct 1, 2016 14:41:06 GMT
Been following this thread with interest and thought I might add a couple of thoughts. As I read the posts I started to go a bit word-blind with all the capital letters and Csus2 etc scattered throughout. I fear that people new to altered tunings might be worrying too much about theory, box or linear scale patterns or what have you instead of concentrating on what is really at the heart of using eg DADGAD. As Chris Wood says in Spitfires, 'it's the sound'. Don't think so much, explore and find what works, what doesn't, what's a horrible discord and what might be an interesting one. Explore, find a signpost to way you want to go and then noodle. Keep listening to what works and what doesn't and the tuning will fall into place.
Just for the record, I have been playing in altered tunings since the 70s, still don't always know what some of them are called or what chords I might be fingering. I think it was Joe Pass who said something like 'there are only six grips'. Over the years I've found that basic modulatable shapes like F, Am, D, C7, D7 work in open tunings although you might have to move them across a string or adjust the fingering slightly. This is what I mean by using chord shapes which I cannot name, they just happen to fit the sound I'm seeking.
Hope this makes sense and isn't off-putting. My basic point is don't get hung up on theory and have fun learning your way around...it's always a different map.
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 1, 2016 16:14:18 GMT
Been following this thread with interest and thought I might add a couple of thoughts. As I read the posts I started to go a bit word-blind with all the capital letters and Csus2 etc scattered throughout. I fear that people new to altered tunings might be worrying too much about theory, box or linear scale patterns or what have you instead of concentrating on what is really at the heart of using eg DADGAD. As Chris Wood says in Spitfires, 'it's the sound'. Don't think so much, explore and find what works, what doesn't, what's a horrible discord and what might be an interesting one. Explore, find a signpost to way you want to go and then noodle. Keep listening to what works and what doesn't and the tuning will fall into place. Just for the record, I have been playing in altered tunings since the 70s, still don't always know what some of them are called or what chords I might be fingering. I think it was Joe Pass who said something like 'there are only six grips'. Over the years I've found that basic modulatable shapes like F, Am, D, C7, D7 work in open tunings although you might have to move them across a string or adjust the fingering slightly. This is what I mean by using chord shapes which I cannot name, they just happen to fit the sound I'm seeking. Hope this makes sense and isn't off-putting. My basic point is don't get hung up on theory and have fun learning your way around...it's always a different map. Spot on.
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Post by ourmaninthenorth on Oct 1, 2016 16:29:50 GMT
Been following this thread with interest and thought I might add a couple of thoughts. As I read the posts I started to go a bit word-blind with all the capital letters and Csus2 etc scattered throughout. I fear that people new to altered tunings might be worrying too much about theory, box or linear scale patterns or what have you instead of concentrating on what is really at the heart of using eg DADGAD. As Chris Wood says in Spitfires, 'it's the sound'. Don't think so much, explore and find what works, what doesn't, what's a horrible discord and what might be an interesting one. Explore, find a signpost to way you want to go and then noodle. Keep listening to what works and what doesn't and the tuning will fall into place.Just for the record, I have been playing in altered tunings since the 70s, still don't always know what some of them are called or what chords I might be fingering. I think it was Joe Pass who said something like 'there are only six grips'. Over the years I've found that basic modulatable shapes like F, Am, D, C7, D7 work in open tunings although you might have to move them across a string or adjust the fingering slightly. This is what I mean by using chord shapes which I cannot name, they just happen to fit the sound I'm seeking. Hope this makes sense and isn't off-putting. My basic point is don't get hung up on theory and have fun learning your way around...it's always a different map. That's rather brilliantly put. I've spent the last 40 years doing just that..finding signposts to work from; in all honesty I can't read the maps, but journey onwards nevertheless. My comment about not knowing what I'm doing in Standard and ergo not knowing what I'm doing in Alternate tunings, was only partially a joke. I simply don't want to know the theory..it interferes with my playing. I've been having a go with Andy's suggested C sus 2 today, it's a lot of fun..but everything I'm playing sounds faintly Scottish...
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