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Post by richard on Feb 8, 2017 14:06:28 GMT
Hi , I have been playing finger style for years but when it comes to jamming I am completely lost. I have looked at the YouTube clips but no one seems to explain the basics. The only scale I know well is the pentatonic scale and some times that seems to work. I really need an idiots guide to Jamming. Does each chord have its own picking paten? if so that sounds quite daunting! Can anyone help me. maybe there is a book or a good You tube explanation?
Richard
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Post by keithambridge on Feb 8, 2017 15:54:49 GMT
Interesting topic Richard! I've always struggled with all but very basic blues stuff, I normally wing it by playing what I know and hoping others with better skills can follow me!! I look foreward to some answers!!
Keith II
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Post by ocarolan on Feb 8, 2017 18:32:30 GMT
Richard good to see you around again - it's been a while!
Apols for not giving the kind of answer you may want, but you can't play what isn't in you. Listen extensively to stuff similar to what you want to play (and even stuff you don't!) - the important word being "listen" - carefully, repeatedly, frequently, extensively. The style will eventually seep into your brain and you find yourself "singing" lines and licks in your head - then all you have to do is play them!
Sorry, but there aren't any short cuts - it's hard work whichever way you go. Yes, you can learn some patterns and "tricks", but they are in the end self limiting and self defeating. If you want to play music, you have to "feel"the music, and have it in you. Your ears are you best friends!
Oh, and maybe a good teacher in the style you want to play might help a little too.
All the best Keith
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Post by vikingblues on Feb 8, 2017 22:39:42 GMT
My experience is right in line with Keiths thoughts!
I'm afraid there can be a lot of work involved and in my case a good deal of hoping to stumble on the right triggers, and right teachers, to speed the learning process. These will be different for different people of course, so while Rob Chapmans intervallic ear training course and David Wallimanns lessons on Pentatonics, modes and improvisations worked for me they won't work for a lot of people.
The only solution I found to even adequate jamming was to train the ears and to listen in the right way so that muscle memory allows the fingers to move to the notes you hear in your head that fit with what you hear the other musicians or the the backing track are playing. It takes a good deal of listening, practice and trial and error to get things working. But it's a mind blowing experience when it first starts to happen on a regular basis.
That acquired skill allows you to to hit target notes that sound particularly good at chord changes and give a sense of purpose to your playing. It also allows you to target notes that are particular to the chord being played in the chord progression. Basically if you can take a backing track of some sort (rock, jazz, country, blues, folk, whatever genre) and you can hum, sing or sing in your head musical lines that fit in with it then it's feasible to jam along to it with the guitar.
The key for me was finding something that unlocked the ability to hear the notes in my head and simultaneously play them on the fretboard. A combination of intervallic ear training and just playing with a lot of backing tracks did this. Plus some video lessons from a teacher whose approach I bought into big time..
One thing I can say - it was worth the effort many times over. Jamming along in a totally focussed way and just letting the music envelop you is such a great feeling - it's damn close to being something spiritual. Not that other people will necessarily like what you're doing, but that's not important.
Good luck with the quest Richard.
Mark
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Post by delb0y on Feb 9, 2017 8:31:18 GMT
To me jamming is sitting in with a bunch of friends / enemies / musicians and playing music on the fly, as it were, sometimes songs that you know, sometimes songs you don't, and trying to find something that fits both the song and what other people are doing with the song from moment to moment. As such it's an ever-shifting landscape.
You mention finger-picking patterns and scales, Richard, so I'm guessing that you're interested in how to play along from a lead (either solo or fills) perspective as well as a rhythm one (those finger-picking patterns - although simple strums work well, too).
There aren't any short-cuts, as Keith said, and Mark highlights a nirvana that I've never been close to attaining (hearing notes in your head and instantly being able to play them), but there are a few things you can use as sign-posts.
Firstly, less is more. I used to think I had to play all the time throughout a song. Now I'm the opposite, the less I can do whilst still making a contribution is best. This means if someone kicks off a song you don't know, there's no need to join in and identify every chord and start blasting away straight from the off. Simply find the key (either ask, watch, or quietly slide one's fingers up and down a bass string until you lock in on the root chord) and maybe drop in a nice little phrase in the musical gaps (in-between vocals - when someone else isn't doing the same).
As to what you play in those little phrases? Well a nice arpeggio lick, a simple blues phrase (if it's a bluesy song) or a major scale phrase if it's a more major sounds. So it is worth knowing a major pentatonic and a minor pentatonic scale that you can move up and down to match different keys.
As the song goes round again you might hear / see / identify a second chord or two. A simple shimmering strum as a chord changes is usually a good contribution, a few more subtle lead licks in the gaps. A nice slide from one chord to another. As the song goes round again you'll find you start to pick up more and more of the chords - unless playing a complex jazz song most tunes are constructed using just a few, and the choices get reasonably easy to identify by ear. That's an area that can be explored in a more lengthy post. But pretty soon you realise that you've identified and are holding/changing chords shapes down for almost the entire song and then you can strum / finger-pick a simple patter that fits, drop in more and more of those phrases and you're doing as much as anyone in the jam session :-)
Sit down in front of the TV / radio / YouTube and play along with random music as if it was a jam session and you can do all of this without fear of embarrassment.
Derek
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Post by richard on Feb 9, 2017 11:56:02 GMT
Many thanks to Mark Derek and Keith II. I blame you all for my lack of sleep last night! I was convinced that I required a technical ability that was way beyond my understanding!
Basically all the replies said the same thing listen as much as you can and then play from the heart. I have tried to jam in a live environment and what with hitting odd bum notes and the background noise I have given up having been afraid of making a fool of myself or even worse putting someone off their playing.
After reading your posts or at least Mark and Keith II‘s (Derek’s post arrived this morning). I sat down and practiced for a good hour last night using the backing tracks on You Tube.
I was amazed how much I really knew! Subconsciously I was hitting the right notes. Also after finding the key and hitting a few wrong notes a picture of the scale I was using emerged and then I was away!
This morning I have been watching “Justin Guitar” (YouTube) Intervallic Ear Training. I am not sure how this fits in with “Jamming” but I am sure if get to the end of the video I will find out! Time overtook me this morning.
So all in all a big thank you for giving me the boost I needed, to say I am elated and on a high would not be an understatement.
Richard
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Post by vikingblues on Feb 9, 2017 23:28:32 GMT
Good to hear about that progress Richard! I still remember the exciting times discovering this area of playing. I'm not sure how ear training fits in quite with jamming either, but I just found that while doing that Rob Chapman course my progress in hearing what to play and hitting the right notes hit turbo mode and accelerated away like mad. Would that I had the musical imagination to extend that progress further. You've encouraged me to dig out the CD and have a listen to a bit of it yesterday - I maybe should see if I can work further through the exercises and see if that helps a bit more. Keep it up .... it can be a very rewarding process! Mark
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Post by gavdav on Feb 10, 2017 11:19:44 GMT
I know nothing about formal ear training, but in my experience you accumulate, over years and years, lots of snippets of melody (fragments/building blocks, call 'em what you will...) and that these are phenomenally helpful - you just know where a tune is going and can quickly relate what you are hearing to the branching tree of musical options that your fingers already know. Improvising for me is a mix of muscle memory, repertoire of these fragments (licks maybe?), a less-is-more approach (especially in a big jam session) and a bit of good taste.
An intuitive grasp of how chords fit within the bar structure (and therefore knowing what key something is in) is my best help - if you can hum the chord changes/bass/root notes for a typical twelve bar then you know what I mean - you can just feel where it will change, and in UK trad music I reckon I could busk a 16 or 32 bar tune in any of the obvious keys (G/D/Em/Am etc). For me, that, plus a rough grasp of the scale shape for those keys is enough. I have a pal who is a jazz/blues player who uses the same approach but can adapt scale on the fly to fit over the chord tonality, which is far beyond my mortal ken (or desire to put the hours into.)
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Post by andrewjw on Feb 22, 2017 19:20:15 GMT
Jamming lesson..."give me a capo"!!!
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