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Post by bellyshere on Oct 6, 2020 18:28:53 GMT
Just wondering what you folks who write do when composing. Do you write words first and add music or music then add words? Or both at the same time. Just being nosey.
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stringdriventhing
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Post by stringdriventhing on Oct 6, 2020 19:48:43 GMT
I don't write many songs (one a year if I'm lucky), but when I do it always starts off with a musical idea of some kind, then a vocal melody and then the lyrics. I find the lyrics the hardest bit, which you would understand if you saw the state of some of them
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2020 20:23:29 GMT
One or the other or both or a beat or a vague idea or a philosophical concept or the sound of traffic or running water or an overheard conversation or the smell or a bakery or something else.
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leoroberts
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My main instrument is: probably needing new strings
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Post by leoroberts on Oct 6, 2020 21:53:11 GMT
As most of my songs are based on jokes, and most of my music is nicked from others - lyrics. Although, technically, the music has been written first. Just not by me. Currently trying to decide if it's worth doing a Dylan parody called " Hey, Mr Tangerine man"....
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colins
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Post by colins on Oct 6, 2020 22:18:46 GMT
As most of my songs are based on jokes, and most of my music is nicked from others - lyrics. Although, technically, the music has been written first. Just not by me. Currently trying to decide if it's worth doing a Dylan parody called " Hey, Mr Tangerine man".... Oh yes please leoroberts!
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Post by andy3sheds on Oct 7, 2020 0:09:09 GMT
Perhaps a good title for it could be "Stay positive Donald" ?
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 7, 2020 8:30:11 GMT
Just wondering what you folks who write do when composing. Do you write words first and add music or music then add words? Or both at the same time. Just being nosey. An intersting question. I make no claims for my own songs but I do write a lot of them! Often I have a notion or an idea. Sometimes I come across a story that I want to share. These are not songs but they linger in the mind or notebooks sometimes for years! The real song always starts with a tune. Sometimes this matches an idea or its feel triggers something off and I start on a path. My song The Ballad of Annie Moore began as a tune. It felt a bit celtic-y. For some reason (that I don't understand) I decided it was a song but I had no idea. An image of clifss and sea come to mind and I thought of emmigration which is a feature of my favourite part of Ireland, West Cork. I put emmigration west cork into Google and up came the story of Annie More — too good to ignore! Sometimes songs are inspired by people and some by places. I've written a lot of songs about West Cork and I worry about authenticity and about avoiding patronising sentiments. Leaving is a theme of some of these while others are based on eccentric stories. I tend to record them and check them out witb the West Cork Music Collective before they get distributed more widely! While authenticity is important they are songs and can be fiction — Nashville songwriter Darrell Scott is very good on this. My song Calias Dawn was written about the Calais Jungle but I worried about it and checked it out with people that I knew had been there often. Sometimes a tune inspires a single fun or nonsense lyric — see My Baby's Left Chicago Town — sometimes the musical theme of a tune suggests a subject. Cooder and Spence was inspired by a meeting between guitar heroes but was inspired by a Spence-like tune. Of course, sometimes you just want to say something or rant about something. By far my most popular song on the net this year has been When I see That Road A Calling which is about Brexit — remember that? I guess professional songwriters and inspired by pressure! This doesn't happen to me much but the Ballad of Johnnie and Sally came from here. Some despicable person decided there should be a songwriting competition at the Halifax gathering. I decided to ignore it but was bullied into writing something. I had no idea what to do and no songs in the pipeline. The week before I was watching a friend performing at a club I was runing. He sang yet another version of Frankie and Johnnie and I thought I should write a local version. I thought the song rubbish really. I sang it at Halifax to almost no reaction. And then one night I was playing at a club that was rammed by convention revellers. I couldn't hear myself and I guess they couldn't. So I just started singing loud stuff and threw this in and it went down a storm. So it stayed. Audience reaction is critical to a song's development, which is a problem at the moment! The Monar Shepherd was a song I really liked but never got any reaction. It got dropped. Then I was playing at a local festival and the act after me didn't turn up and I was told keep going. I threw this one in and somebody in the front row said 'that's lovely'. That was enough to make the song live. Weirdly, this song always gets a strong reaction now. Maybe my performance has changed and is more confident now.
This is a long-winded way of saying the tune always comes first but many other factors influence the development of a song.
I have two on the stocks at the moment. The first is back to West Cork again and was inspired by a friend's photograph on Facebook — he lives in Canada now and so the theme of leaving returned! The second is just a tune. It has been around for a while. It has verses, a chorus and a middle eight. It has a Chris Smithers vibe. But I have no ideas for lyrics. If I worked with others I'd just give somebody the tune and let them worry about it. Just recently the tune has begun to dominate my conciousness and probably means some lyrics will follow shortly. Or not :-)
All of this basicvally shows how songwriting is a voodoo liuke experience. It isn't science but I'm not sure what it is. If I don't have an idea running around in my head I can be pretty sure that I will do soon.
As the songwriter I simply don't have a view of whether any of them are any good !
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Post by bellyshere on Oct 7, 2020 8:44:11 GMT
I tend to get a nice groove going and think I should stick some words on that and often it comes together quickly. Recently my music head is lacking ideas and I have been writing lots of lyrics about all sorts of stuff. Maybe when some some fresh guitar noises appear I can use them. One thing I’ve never done is write songs with others even though I’ve been in lots of bands. I’ve always written stuff and brought it fully formed to the band.
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 7, 2020 8:48:52 GMT
I tend to get a nice groove going and think I should stick some words on that and often it comes together quickly. Recently my music head is lacking ideas and I have been writing lots of lyrics about all sorts of stuff. Maybe when some some fresh guitar noises appear I can use them. One thing I’ve never done is write songs with others even though I’ve been in lots of bands. I’ve always written stuff and brought it fully formed to the band. I've written with others a couple of times but really don't enjoy it. Others naturally take songs in different directions but they always sound unfinished to me!
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stringdriventhing
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Post by stringdriventhing on Oct 7, 2020 11:29:47 GMT
One thing I’ve never done is write songs with others even though I’ve been in lots of bands. I’ve always written stuff and brought it fully formed to the band. I had a go at that recently - a pal had some musical ideas but wasn't sure what to do with them. I took the bits he had, changed them slightly and added a few more bits, a vocal melody and lyrics. I quite like the way it turned out - not sure if he did I'd like to do more things like that, but maybe the other way around - me providing the musical ideas and someone else doing the lyrics.
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Post by PistolPete on Oct 7, 2020 15:04:52 GMT
I normally do both at the same time to some extent - I sort of work outwards from a line or hook to a first verse or chorus, then work out the structure & write the rest of the lyrics. I put this out on social media last year in response to a question about my songwriting "process":
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 7, 2020 17:11:37 GMT
I normally do both at the same time to some extent - I sort of work outwards from a line or hook to a first verse or chorus, then work out the structure & write the rest of the lyrics. I put this out on social media last year in response to a question about my songwriting "process": You haven't mentioned that horrible thing when you coe up with a good tune. Make sure it is still there a few hours later. Go to bed humming it. Wake up next morning with no clue how to get it back ...
... I tell you, the songs I nearly wrote ....
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2020 19:50:28 GMT
Voice recorder on your phone?
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 8, 2020 7:53:39 GMT
Voice recorder on your phone?
You've spotted the rather gaping gap in my discipline regime!
The best musical note taking app I've found is Topline from Abbey Road. I use to this to record fragments of guitar or sometimes to hum a tune or, say, a piece of a chorus. This can actually be used to add two or three tracks and so you can put down a guitar idea and then put a vocal over the top of it.
Of course, I mostly don't use it!
However, a quick look at the app now shows me that two of my latest songs have started life there.
Topline is free as well! I'm surprised we don't hear more about it. It works. Well, it does when I remember it exists ....
... It's an age thing.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2020 8:23:11 GMT
Voice recorder on your phone?
You've spotted the rather gaping gap in my discipline regime!
The best musical note taking app I've found is Topline from Abbey Road. I use to this to record fragments of guitar or sometimes to hum a tune or, say, a piece of a chorus. This can actually be used to add two or three tracks and so you can put down a guitar idea and then put a vocal over the top of it.
Of course, I mostly don't use it!
However, a quick look at the app now shows me that two of my latest songs have started life there.
Topline is free as well! I'm surprised we don't hear more about it. It works. Well, it does when I remember it exists ....
... It's an age thing.
The great thing about the phone recorder app is that it's usually within reach for most people. It's only a single track but it is easy to operate and great for getting down a chord / rhythm pattern, vocal or lyric fragment or somesuch if you're worried you might forget it. Having said that, I don't use mine much and often don't even bother to take it out with me - although in my defence my focus is on things other than writing at the moment.
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