|
Post by solidtop on Oct 24, 2015 8:44:53 GMT
I must admit, I've not read through all the posts here on this thread but can anyone recommend a book on composing tunes? My stuff sounds fairly generic and sometimes I don't even know where to go with stuff. It might just be me being over critical but I should be better than I am I think. I've attached a link if anyone cares to offer an opinion, or can give a good recommendation for how I play. Thanks. soundcloud.com/beginner_guitarist
|
|
|
Post by vikingblues on Oct 24, 2015 12:52:00 GMT
can anyone recommend a book on composing tunes? I'd also be interested to know if there's a magical book out there that does that job. So far in my limited attempts I've found trying to compose from a theory base has been a disaster. Quite possibly due to my lack of ability to take the theory on board and understand it, rather than a fault in the teaching material. As such the only reasonably effective method I've found is either via improv or by stealing fragments of ideas and then trying to mould them and link them somehow into something different that is mine. Mark
|
|
ocarolan
Global Moderator
CURMUDGEONLY OLD GIT (leader - to join, just ask!)
Posts: 33,696
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"c0cfe1"}
Mini-Profile Name Color: 182a3f
Mini-Profile Text Color: 733a1c
|
Post by ocarolan on Oct 24, 2015 13:21:14 GMT
How to write tunes? Wow. That's a BIG question!
Some personal thoughts you are welcome to ponder or ignore as you wish!...
I believe the best way to learn to write tunes (whether for songs or instrumental pieces) is, er, to write tunes...lots of them....and be prepared to throw most of them away, keeping only the better ones and binning/recycling/altering the ones that are less effective.
Also, I don't believe anyone can come out with anything that isn't already in them - and the best way to get the music into you in the first place is to listen, listen, listen to loads of music of all types. Certainly not just guitar music, certainly not just singer songwriter stuff, certainly not just the type you want to emulate, but as wide a spectrum of music as you can manage. It is a lifetime's work, but you have to start somewhere.
Listen to the melodies. Listen to what is happening beneath the melody, especially the bass. Fool around on the guitar an discover how these things interact.
There is no quick fix. It requires a lot of (hopefully enjoyable) work over a long period of time, but during that you will come up with a lot of usable stuff, as well as learning a lot.
A lot is down to instinct rather than rules - follow your instincts. It will get easier.
Keith
|
|
|
Post by solidtop on Oct 24, 2015 21:13:13 GMT
That might be where I'm struggling. I have a basic understanding of theory which I started learning after I'd made a couple of tunes and decided I wanted to progress. I was sticking to a 4 chord sequence repeated a couple of times then doing an alteration for the end of the second run then going into a chorus that repeated every couple of bars. It never sounded as fluid as my tunes before I started theory.
I've recently written a couple of tubes that I quite like but all but ignored the theory other than staying in key and substituting the a couple of chords and i can hear an improvement. I just wondered if there were any hard and fast song blue prints like verse, verse, chorus, verse, chorus, middle, chorus, end or what ever. Or can you just do it how you want?
|
|
ocarolan
Global Moderator
CURMUDGEONLY OLD GIT (leader - to join, just ask!)
Posts: 33,696
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"c0cfe1"}
Mini-Profile Name Color: 182a3f
Mini-Profile Text Color: 733a1c
|
Post by ocarolan on Oct 24, 2015 22:48:18 GMT
There certainly are common song forms as you describe, Steve, and many of them. But nothing prescriptive.
By all means try them, use them, adapt them, ignore them. Go with what sounds good to you and what you feel the tune or song calls for.
Sorry if that doesn't sound too helpful, but it comes back to actively listening to music rather than following "rules". Listen carefully to a few dozen of your favourite songs or tunes, and examine how they are constructed - listen for the different sections and how the overall piece is structured using them. Listen to a particular section and se how it is made up - how the different lines work/repeat or whatever. And listen to individual lines to see where the melody goes up/down etc and if there are repeating phrases melodically or rhythmically. It'll be a very worthwhile exercise.
No harm in taking ideas from stuff you already know - there's nothing genuinely new, but I agree wholeheartedly that it can be difficult to come up with something that really does sound fresh and original!
Good luck!
Keith
|
|
Martin
Administrator
Posts: 11,866
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"http://mandocello.org/lytebox/images/adirondack.jpg","color":""}
Mini-Profile Name Color: 0a530b
Mini-Profile Text Color: 4f3517
|
Post by Martin on Oct 25, 2015 0:34:52 GMT
|
|
|
Post by vikingblues on Oct 25, 2015 8:00:20 GMT
Yes - quite a long time ago I did get that book. But it really did seem more about writing songs than tunes.
If memory serves it very much concentrated on chords and chord progressions. But it is quite a while since I sold it on so I can't refresh my memory on how true that recollection is. The reviews of it on Amazon do seem to talk a lot about the chords aspect though.
Mark
|
|
maninashed
Cheerfully Optimistic
Mad Farmer Liberation Front
Posts: 4,195
|
Post by maninashed on Oct 26, 2015 6:33:55 GMT
|
|
|
Post by andyhowell on Oct 26, 2015 7:57:08 GMT
Some great books there. These days I tend to think that those books that are about music and philosophy are more useful than tab books but a good tab book can open up bits if technique that have previously seemed unfathomable,
Rob Mc's recent books on Scottish tunes is very useful. I like McTell's tab books as they give you access to a lovely and not too technical style - they give you a good grounding in ragtime and country blues; I learnt more from these than I did from Stephan Grossman.
Finally, another vote of support for Cool and Unusual and USA era Simpson. The instrumental albums he made at this time were beautiful, relatively sparse and economic in style. I seem to remember that each of these came with a tab book. Many of these tabs are available from his website but getting the albums is a little more difficult. Besides Cool and Unusual snap up copies of 'Leaves of Life', 'When I was on Horseback' (or something like that ), 'Nobody's Fault but Mine' and the gospel album 'A Closer Walk with The'. I learnt a lot from these albums which are strong on not only DADGAD and Csus 4 but also Dropped D. If you see these second hand don't hesitate!
|
|
|
Post by solidtop on Oct 28, 2015 22:13:15 GMT
thanks for the tips guys! i will have a look at those books and also spend a bit more time actually analising how the tunes i like are constructed and see how it goes
|
|
minorkey
C.O.G.
Too many instruments, too little time
Posts: 2,992
My main instrument is: hurting my fingers!
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"72dd98"}
|
Post by minorkey on Nov 27, 2015 19:13:54 GMT
Is there a Segovia biography? Or Julian Bream? I enjoy reading (and watching) artist bios
|
|
missclarktree
C.O.G.
Posts: 2,423
My main instrument is: It varies
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"1979e6"}
Mini-Profile Name Color: 100605
Mini-Profile Text Color: 020a12
|
Post by missclarktree on Nov 28, 2015 20:10:44 GMT
Is there a Segovia biography? Or Julian Bream? I enjoy reading (and watching) artist bios Segovia: a celebration of the man and his music, by Graham Wade. Published in 1983 by Allison & Busby.
|
|
|
Post by jonnymosco on Nov 28, 2015 21:09:43 GMT
Is there a Segovia biography? Or Julian Bream? I enjoy reading (and watching) artist bios "A Life on the Road" about Bream is a great read. Jonny
|
|
minorkey
C.O.G.
Too many instruments, too little time
Posts: 2,992
My main instrument is: hurting my fingers!
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"72dd98"}
|
Post by minorkey on Nov 29, 2015 11:56:12 GMT
Cheers guys!
|
|
lefthook
Strummer
Posts: 27
My main instrument is: Freshman FA1DC
|
Post by lefthook on Jan 30, 2016 15:30:02 GMT
I had once mentioned that I usually put guitar-related books in two different sections: one is the tune-based, where it's mainly the tunes that are relevant (like the all-famous Traveller's Tales or the Butterfly Arrangements), the other one is the theory-based, where the main topic is the what and how, and tunes are used as an academic tool. One of my favourites belonging to the latter part is Doug Young's Understanding DADGAD for Fingerstyle Guitar You could walk this book through from beginning to end, and you can also flip through the pages (or the CD) to watch out for things that are of interest to you. As a newbie, could you explain the acronym DADGAD to a novice please, and any other ones I might come across on the forum?
|
|