stringdriventhing
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Post by stringdriventhing on Aug 7, 2021 12:44:06 GMT
Can't deny he's a phenomenal musician. I'd consider going to see him live for the spectacle, but I wouldn't listen to his stuff for entertainment.
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Post by fred7 on Aug 7, 2021 13:12:20 GMT
One of the greatest pleasures in learning how to do something is showing others what you can do. Otherwise there would be no need gold medals or places like the Plucky Duck. If I could play like Tommy I'd want to show off but 4 minutes was a bit too much for me to enjoy as a watcher. Impressed for the first 2 minutes but getting hard work to keep up from then on. It's a bit like adding sugar to your perfect brew.
I would love to see him play live though.
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walkingdecay
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Post by walkingdecay on Aug 7, 2021 15:44:35 GMT
One of the greatest pleasures in learning how to do something is showing others what you can do. Otherwise there would be no need gold medals or places like the Plucky Duck. If I could play like Tommy I'd want to show off but 4 minutes was a bit too much for me to enjoy as a watcher. Impressed for the first 2 minutes but getting hard work to keep up from then on. It's a bit like adding sugar to your perfect brew. I would love to see him play live though. I remember a lad on the old Acoustic magazine forum (the one whose ashes this one was built on by Martin and Keith) posting a version of Mississippi Blues. It could be accused of coming straight from Stefan Grossman's tab, but it had musicality, dignity - it had something. Then someone else posted a video of Emmanuel doing a version - it could be that sort of forum at times - which was, indeed, technically phenomenal. The stately old bues was speeded up, stood on its head and kicked into as many shapes as the can of peaches in Three Men In A Boat. Impressive - but not as much so as the version by the lad who had got inside the music and made it his own. I think "superpicker" technique can get in the way sometimes. Listen to Doc Watson's early recordings and they're steeped in the oftentimes dark inherited tradition of his family and music he had been inspired by, where later he seemed preoccupied with impressing an audience. The standing ovations came from playing Black Mountain Rag at the speed of light, not some minor key song about an English cuckold which had somehow found its way to the Blue Ridge. it needed a sensitive collaborater like David Grisman to occasionally draw the old Doc out of hiding. I dunno, maybe it's me being cranky again. John Hartford once remarked in song that style is based on limitations and I immediately seized on that, perhaps as an excuse to inwardly talk up my own constrained abilities.
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Post by scorpiodog on Aug 7, 2021 17:20:15 GMT
There’s no doubting TE’s ability. I went to see him once. His playing and showmanship are incredible. I’m glad I did. But I would think twice before going to see him again.
A firework display is a great thing to watch, but would you want to watch one for two hours?
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Post by malcolm on Aug 7, 2021 18:39:06 GMT
One of the greatest pleasures in learning how to do something is showing others what you can do. Otherwise there would be no need gold medals or places like the Plucky Duck. If I could play like Tommy I'd want to show off but 4 minutes was a bit too much for me to enjoy as a watcher. Impressed for the first 2 minutes but getting hard work to keep up from then on. It's a bit like adding sugar to your perfect brew. I would love to see him play live though. I remember a lad on the old Acoustic magazine forum (the one whose ashes this one was built on by Martin and Keith) posting a version of Mississippi Blues. It could be accused of coming straight from Stefan Grossman's tab, but it had musicality, dignity - it had something. Then someone else posted a video of Emmanuel doing a version - it could be that sort of forum at times - which was, indeed, technically phenomenal. The stately old bues was speeded up, stood on its head and kicked into as many shapes as the can of peaches in Three Men In A Boat. Impressive - but not as much so as the version by the lad who had got inside the music and made it his own. I think "superpicker" technique can get in the way sometimes. Listen to Doc Watson's early recordings and they're steeped in the oftentimes dark inherited tradition of his family and music he had been inspired by, where later he seemed preoccupied with impressing an audience. The standing ovations came from playing Black Mountain Rag at the speed of light, not some minor key song about an English cuckold which had somehow found its way to the Blue Ridge. it needed a sensitive collaborater like David Grisman to occasionally draw the old Doc out of hiding. I dunno, maybe it's me being cranky again. John Hartford once remarked in song that style is based on limitations and I immediately seized on that, perhaps as an excuse to inwardly talk up my own constrained abilities. Very well put, Mississippi blues is a great example of a fabulous tune in its basic form, that has been turned on its head several times by many virtuoso players not only TE. I think it's a shame but obviously this sort of thing sells concert tickets. It's interesting that the same thing happens in Irish music sessions, the tunes are speeded up, presumably to display virtuosity, but often the soul of the piece is lost.
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Post by malcolm on Aug 7, 2021 18:40:37 GMT
There’s no doubting TE’s ability. I went to see him once. His playing and showmanship are incredible. I’m glad I did. But I would think twice before going to see him again. A firework display is a great thing to watch, but would you want to watch one for two hours? I agree, I only went to see him the second time to please a friend.
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tangledfool
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Post by tangledfool on Aug 7, 2021 20:08:21 GMT
Having been somewhat oblivious to the work of Mr Emmanuel I watched the video to enlighten myself, and lasted around 51 seconds before uttering "F*** off." Indeed it is technically brilliant to perform at such speed and to incorporate so many different elements and styles, but I was left wanting to watch/hear some genuine spanish/flamenco rather than some acoustic shredded version.
To cleanse the palate I had to go back to something more primitive.
My opinion on Mr Emmanuel - technician? Yes. Musician? Debatable.
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Post by NikGnashers on Aug 7, 2021 20:37:00 GMT
I think he's amazing.
Going to see him in March next year.
Yes he can be flashy, but he can also be subtle and musical too. He can seemingly do everything well, and some of the stuff he does with Richard Smith is stunning.
Nobody can say this isn't musical :
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Post by delb0y on Aug 7, 2021 22:29:37 GMT
I saw him and it was a great gig - I reviewed the show in these very forums. I'd love to see him again. And Richard Smith, too. He's possibly even more unbelievable. There are many great players at that level. Funny thing is, though, like others, I thinks Tommy's great live but have never been moved to buy his records. Not sure why that is. But I do have a stack of Fahey CDs, and Huttlinger, and Grossman and Jones and Ton van Bergyck etc etc so there must be something that gets lost when the visuals and the atmosphere isn't there with Tommy.
Cheers Derek
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Post by Onechordtrick on Aug 8, 2021 4:47:52 GMT
I was also unaware of his work so had a listen on YouTube and it left me rather cold. He’s obviously technically very competent but it all felt very rushed; as if he was contracted to play a certain number of notes and wanted to get them out of the way as quickly as possible.
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Post by malcolm on Aug 8, 2021 10:01:39 GMT
I think he's amazing. Going to see him in March next year. Yes he can be flashy, but he can also be subtle and musical too. He can seemingly do everything well, and some of the stuff he does with Richard Smith is stunning. Nobody can say this isn't musical : I agree, his soulful musical stuff is lovely, but I suspect it's the fast flashy playing that sells the tickets. In my experience very few people want to listen to slow jazz played on an acoustic guitar, unless of course they are guitar players themselves.
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Martin
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Post by Martin on Aug 8, 2021 10:54:22 GMT
There’s no doubting TE’s ability. I went to see him once. His playing and showmanship are incredible. I’m glad I did. But I would think twice before going to see him again. A firework display is a great thing to watch, but would you want to watch one for two hours? Exactly this. I saw him live several years ago, supported by the wonderful Andy McKee. The first half was incredible, exciting and awe inspiring. The second half was exhausting and I did get a little bored 😐 I don’t want to lay into him because there is an element of jealousy that I’ll never master the guitar in that way, and he seems like a genuinely funny, warm and entertaining guy. A really great live performer, who can also write some lovely stuff, but I too don’t have any of his CDs…
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Post by andyhowell on Aug 10, 2021 7:37:28 GMT
I tend to agree with Martin. The guy has stunning technique and can write lovely melodies — but seeing him live is just too much for me. He seems to be playing for a YouTube audience but, ironically, he seems better suited to YT shorts! But as Chet pickers go, you can't get much better — certainly much faster (which is the problem I think).
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Post by delb0y on Aug 10, 2021 10:27:54 GMT
I was thinking about more about young Tommy, and I went back and re-listened/watched to a few favourites. Here are some highlights, but there are scores more.
Tommy and Mark Knopfler on a great tune about old cars:
Tommy with Frank Vignola on Woodsongs:
How about Tommy and Frank and Vinny - not a bunch of Mafia hitmen, but equally as scary:
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Post by borborygmus on Aug 12, 2021 12:29:53 GMT
No disrespect to Tommy Emmanuel, who is undoubtedly a highly accomplished player, but would you really want to play like that? I feel it becomes unmusical at that speed. I have seen Tommy play live twice and, he doesn't do a lot of it, but I much prefer his slow soulful playing. I have seen him live, and he doesn't do it for me. Obviously he is extremely talented. But he can rip the soul out of an instrument and leave it lying dead on the floor. I did find this recent interview/podcast interesting though: walkingthefloor.com/episode-185-tommy-emmanuel/
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