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Post by fatfingerjohn on Jul 31, 2023 7:26:24 GMT
Hi,
Reaching my twilight years and so far have avoided using a pick/plectrum for 50 years. Tried it a few times and just didn't feel right. I suppose also I tended, wrongly no doubt, to 'look down on it' a bit, thinking my fingers were meant for the job. Also recognising that I've never practised scales etc and do very little playing on individual strings (except bass notes within a chord with my thumb and fingerstyle patterns), solo work (except a few runups/downs and a little melody picking with thumb/fingers) etc, mainly accompanying either fingerstyle or strumming.
I've always felt that there is so much else to learn (and the list just gets longer!). I've also tried thumb/finger picks, but usually to avoid broken nails which I rarely get now since using OPI nail strengthener.
Where do you guys and gals sit on this. Do you regularly use a plectrum? Should I make this a target in next 12 months to practice? Or is it the devil's bit of plastic? .
FFJ
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ocarolan
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Post by ocarolan on Jul 31, 2023 7:41:34 GMT
Just do what you need to do to play the music you want to play in the way that you feel is right.
What a useless answer eh?!
You don't have to use a pick, but if you give it a serious go you will probably be glad you did. It will give you more flexibility in what you do, and more definition to certain styles. You can still use a couple of fingers as well as the pick which gives you a halfway house between plectrum work and fingerstyle - I do that a fair bit. I find it hard to strum without a pick, but using doesn't need to confine you to full on strumming. Dum ching dum ching sounds better with a pick and those little runs etc and top string twiddles in that style are likely to be clearer with a pick that fingers.
It's also a very cheap amplifier for your instruments!
Keith
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delb0y
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Post by delb0y on Jul 31, 2023 8:02:17 GMT
Yes, get a pick. :-)
There are some styles that are so much fun to play but for which a pick is (almost) essential. Flatpicking (*), Gypsy jazz, to name but two.
That said, when I decided to first try a thumb-pick it took a couple of failed attempts and about a year of concerted effort before it became comfortable. So be aware that changing, or adding to, one's right hand technique is not a short journey. But you know that anyway.
I'm primarily a thumb-picker (which I think is like a finger-picker but more primitive...) but thoroughly enjoy getting a pick out.
(*) Like bluegrass but without the high lonesome voices and dodgy songs. One of my favourite flat pickers:
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leoroberts
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Post by leoroberts on Jul 31, 2023 8:56:55 GMT
You can still use a couple of fingers as well as the pick which gives you a halfway house between plectrum work and fingerstyle. Keith I’ve never managed the ‘hybrid’ style used so effectively by Paul Brady And, of course, Gordon Giltrap. I either strum all the way through or fingerpick all the way through. (On the rare occasions where a bit of strummage is required in a fingerpicked song, I tend to use the back of my nails)
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Phil Taylor
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Post by Phil Taylor on Jul 31, 2023 10:16:27 GMT
I started trying to use a pick in early in 2021 for a change. Primarily it was because of the Eric Skye series of fiddle tune videos that are in the main quite slow and very melodic. I had used a pick during my teen years playing electric guitar but mainly fingerstyle since then so it was a challenge for me.I found that the tone I produced was more pleasing than fingerstyle and probably half my playing time is with a pick.
I found it opened up a whole new side to acoustic guitar that I really enjoy so I'm sure I made the correct decision.
I don't know whether or not the above will help you in your decision John but picks are very cheap so just give it a go.
Just one more thing though. I haven't done any courses or do exercises or practice scales or anything like that. All I'm interested is learning tunes, recording some of them on video and then I move on to something else.
Phil
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Post by scorpiodog on Jul 31, 2023 11:11:44 GMT
I've always used a pick for strummage and a few very simple single note runs (in the strummagey songs). I really don't know why, it just seemed right when I was 14 or 15. I seem virtually incapable of strumming without one, and certainly it affects my damping if I try. I guess 70% of my playing is fingerstyle, though.
What I did discover though, when I launched a disastrous foray into mandolin, was that a thick (over 1mm) pick is far more useful for cross picking than the medium gauge (0.7 or 0.8mm) that I habitually use with a guitar.
I'd give a plectrum a go, if I were you, John. They're very cheap. Get a good selection of shapes, sizes and thicknesses to try out (pm me if you'd like me to send you a selection), then decide on one and use it exclusively for a fairly long period of time (weeks or months), and I think you'll be surprised at what you'll be able to do with one.
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Post by martinrowe on Jul 31, 2023 11:31:08 GMT
I started to try and use a pick a few years ago. It has taken a while. I think I had tried when I was younger and had failed. I think I looked down on it. An Acoustic guitar = wood and steel, and I like wood, and, now 'use a bit of plastic'??. So I tried one, didn't like it, and was too impatient, that is different to 'I tried a pick, can use one, and have chosen not to' i.e. I was kidding myself. I found it very difficult and went back to the fingers - they don't make such a clanging noise if you are too heavy handed. But at the same time I knew that Django had used one, and all those country players. I learnt fingerpicking acoustic blues and the more I found out about stringed/plucked instruments the more I discovered that even in the distant past people had used something other than fingers to activate a string e.g. in the 18th Century the end point of a feather. What really swung it for me was the realisation that 'If I play a stringed instrument then I should really be able to use a pick'. So I started on the Mandolin with the idea that it would iron out the things that would help me improve i.e. using a pick and getting into some more musical theory. I can use one now, I do all the time. What people don't often mention is that using one is an ongoing process. You can get to a point where you can use one but there are all sorts of variations - slanting it one way to get one sound and holding it tighter or looser to get another. I found it extremely frustrating at first. Here is, what I consider to be the key. For up and down strokes the hand position remains the same, the pick moves and does the work. To facilitate this you have to hold it relatively loosely, but not loose enough so that it moves all over the place. What helps me is that it is a variation of: 'you let the tool do the work'. Here is the best video I've found that describes this, it's by a mandolin player but the same applies for a guitar. As said though there are a lot of variations but this is a major stepping stone: Pick Hold Lauren PriceThe pick hold description is from minutes 28 to 34. The real insight is from 31 to 34. What Pick? This was a thread a few weeks ago. I came across this last week. Here is a video that compares about 8 (I think) very good picks. He comes up with a very common sense conclusion at the end - the last two minutes. Joe K Walsh pick comparisonHope it helps. I'm glad I stated on the path.
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Post by lavaman on Jul 31, 2023 15:13:31 GMT
Hi John
I've been fingerpicking for years but recently I damaged my thumb at exactly the point where I hit the strings. My thumb is better now but at least it gave me the opportunity to explore the various types of pick on the market. I bought about 25 different picks mail order from Eagle Music. I now have a wide variety of thicknesses, shapes, and colours (and a tin to keep them in).
What I discovered is that the pick thickness and its material have a huge influence on the sound. Some picks work well with one guitar but not another. So what I'm saying is buy a big selection and work through them to find what works for you.
On a positive note, after playing with a pick for one day I wrote a song that I probably wouldn't have if I was fingerpicking.
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Post by fatfingerjohn on Jul 31, 2023 16:48:16 GMT
What a great set of replies, thanks everybody. I few comments back ...
Keith. I know you use a thumb pick. I've tried one once for 5 minutes (shows how tenacious I am!) but was uncomfortable (small and tight) and just felt very strange. Is there a large one for my fat thumb you might recommend?
Delboy. Thanks for the useful info. I fear my basic skills are so far down the range that the videos are just in my dreams, but good to look at.
Leo. I think you and I are similar as I use nails strumming and fingerstyle. I do a bit of hybrid of a fashion but nowhere near that standard, and again, with nails.
Phil. A very encouraging reply thanks. I will have to perservere, as if someone of your ability (way beyond mine) finds it so rewarding it must be worth it. Just hope I'm not too late.
Paul. Thanks so much for the generous offer but I did get a small collection many years ago but gave up too quickly so I will have to have another go. INteresting about your muting; I find this impossible as I hold my thumb about 45degrees to the strings and can't then damp properly; another thing on my list.
Martin. Very useful info and learning about your journey. Perhaps I could try it with a mandolin to see what its like as I won't have so many ingrained habits and preferences. I do have a (cheap) Mandola whch has got a bit more room for my fingers so might give that a go.
Iain. I remember you saying about your thumb. I'm not going to purposely disable myself to force practising with a pick but interesting that you found it rewarding.
Again, thanks for all your help and advice.
FFJ
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leoroberts
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Post by leoroberts on Jul 31, 2023 16:51:27 GMT
What a great set of replies, thanks everybody. I few comments back ...Keith. I know you use a thumb pick. I've tried one once for 5 minutes (shows how tenacious I am!) but was uncomfortable (small and tight) and just felt very strange. Is there a large one for my fat thumb you might recommend? If ocarolan suggests anything other than these, he's wrong
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Post by borborygmus on Jul 31, 2023 16:58:00 GMT
You can still use a couple of fingers as well as the pick which gives you a halfway house between plectrum work and fingerstyle. Keith I’ve never managed the ‘hybrid’ style used so effectively by Paul Brady And, of course, Gordon Giltrap. And Richard Thompson... Many people use a thumb pick for fingerstyle (e.g. Martin Simpson), which then allows some ready strumming just by grasping it like a regular pick. Taking this to the next level are these guys: Black MountainJudging by the (rather good) answers, maybe the question should be "Should I start trying to use a pick, any pick, which pick, some pick or other..." Peter
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Post by Vinny on Jul 31, 2023 17:43:38 GMT
Go for it, John. I’d agree with all of the above advice. Think of all the Gordon Lightfoot strums. One advantage that you have as a non plectrum user is that you can decide how best to hold it and not develop a technique which can be difficult to unlearn, like I did. I hold it between my thumb and first TWO fingers, using the pads of all three. This didn’t seem a problem until I attempted hybrid picking like Paul Brady’s Arthur McBride or Lakes of Ponchartrain, which highlighted the waste of the middle finger. That’s my excuse for my version of hybrid picking.
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Post by ocarolan on Jul 31, 2023 18:02:37 GMT
What a great set of replies, thanks everybody. I few comments back ...Keith. I know you use a thumb pick. I've tried one once for 5 minutes (shows how tenacious I am!) but was uncomfortable (small and tight) and just felt very strange. Is there a large one for my fat thumb you might recommend? If ocarolan suggests anything other than these, he's wrong Agree entirely Leo - Fred Kelly Speed Picks by far the easiest thumbpicks to use for me, and come in a range of sizes, flexibilities etc. However, unlike borborygmus, I am totally incapable of strumming or flatpicking with a thumbpick! But thanks Leo - that's the first time I've been right all day... Keith PS Vinny - me too - thumb and two finger grip on a flat pick. Much easier to be louder and softer, and lots easier for full on strumming. If you squeeze a thin pick between thumb and two fingers, thus slightly curving it, it sounds more like a thicker pick. But yes, hybrid picking does need a little shift of grip.
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Post by earwighoney on Jul 31, 2023 20:13:34 GMT
Reaching my twilight years and so far have avoided using a pick/plectrum for 50 years. Tried it a few times and just didn't feel right. I'd say keep on playing as you do.
There's a guy who posts up YT videos, who plays a lot of electric guitar for styles that would traditionally use a pick but there's none in sight.
Have a look at his picking technique if you have the chance.
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Post by lavaman on Jul 31, 2023 22:10:56 GMT
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