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Post by robmc on Sept 8, 2020 14:05:16 GMT
I'm a novice at playing out but yeah I get nervous!! I think it is a combination of putting too much pressure on myself, overthinking things too much and worrying what others think too much... oh and I don't 'know' what I'm doing. It's definitely all in the mind as there are times when I have no issues, usually after a relaxed drink and I drop the hang ups, I just feel settled for some reason. Paul, maybe it's because when you did the first few gigs it was fun and relaxed and now it has turned into something more where you're trying new or more unfamiliar material to create variety...? Anyhow I liked Martin's video, if I can focus and block out all the noise (mostly in my head in my case!) it helps... I bookmarked the video below because I found it interesting when I watched it, but Grayn's method sounds okay too!! Four tips from elite sport for everyday life
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stringdriventhing
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Post by stringdriventhing on Sept 8, 2020 16:05:52 GMT
I get really nervous before any gig and that usually extends into at least the first 2 or 3 songs and causes me to make more mistakes than I would if I was playing in the house. That's the main reason why I don't enjoy playing on my own and I have a lot of respect for people who do. What I try to tell myself is that nobody really notices your mistakes unless you draw attention to them. I've learned the hard way that drink doesn't help with this in my case.
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Post by forestdweller on Sept 8, 2020 16:20:34 GMT
Happened to me when back in January I decided to attend a local folk club for the first time. I was dutifully given a slot to play the three songs I had been practicing. Except that the guy just before me decided to sing “Fields of Gold”, one of the pieces I had planned to play. Bugger! I played my first piece, She Moved Through the Fair, which went down very well. I was still buzzing from this when I was trying to work out what I should do next! Then instead of Fields of Gold I decided to do one of my own pieces, Tamar Valley, which I ought to have been able to play in my sleep as it was my own piece and had been playing it for a number of years. Couldn’t get past about 8 bars- somehow in the heat of the moment I just couldn’t remember how to get past that 8th bar. In the end had to give up, explain that I hadn’t planned to play that piece and that I would instead play Fields of Gold. Didn’t go down well, probably a big no no in a folk club to repeat something that had already been performed. But yes, my brain seems to go to mush if I have not run through a piece not long before performing it.
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Post by jwills57 on Sept 8, 2020 17:00:32 GMT
Toby Walker, a great American blues and ragtime guitar player and a great teacher, has a prescription that is something like "the rule of 48" (don't quote me exactly). He doesn't play anything, ever, in public until he has first played it more-or-less flawlessly at home in practice 48 times. I think this is a good rule. For me personally, my mind can deceive my fingers into thinking I've learned something when in fact I haven't. There's learning a new piece; there's memorizing a new piece; there's mastery of a new piece; then there's performance mastery of a new piece. I used to go regularly to the AccentOnMusic (check out the website, really great stuff) guitar seminar held every summer in Portland, Oregon. Mark Hanson ran a great camp, had lessons with the best of the best players over a week's time. His wife, a professional trained singer, ran a side 1-hour seminar on "musical performance." I took it a couple of times. What I learned--performing and playing are different skills. You can learn to perform, just like you can learn to play. This was an incredibly valuable insight for me. Hope this helps. Best, Jack
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Post by forestdweller on Sept 8, 2020 17:30:17 GMT
Toby Walker, a great American blues and ragtime guitar player and a great teacher, has a prescription that is something like "the rule of 48" (don't quote me exactly). He doesn't play anything, ever, in public until he has first played it more-or-less flawlessly at home in practice 48 times. I think this is a good rule. For me personally, my mind can deceive my fingers into thinking I've learned something when in fact I haven't. There's learning a new piece; there's memorizing a new piece; there's mastery of a new piece; then there's performance mastery of a new piece. I used to go regularly to the AccentOnMusic (check out the website, really great stuff) guitar seminar held every summer in Portland, Oregon. Mark Hanson ran a great camp, had lessons with the best of the best players over a week's time. His wife, a professional trained singer, ran a side 1-hour seminar on "musical performance." I took it a couple of times. What I learned--performing and playing are different skills. You can learn to perform, just like you can learn to play. This was an incredibly valuable insight for me. Hope this helps. Best, Jack Reminds me of a maths poster I used to have in my classroom - “an expert is someone who practices until they can’t get it wrong”. 😊
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Post by curmudgeon on Sept 10, 2020 0:44:41 GMT
Hi, I've brrn there, done it, and I find understanding it helps :
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leoroberts
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Post by leoroberts on Sept 10, 2020 5:24:57 GMT
Reminds me of a maths poster I used to have in my classroom - “an expert is someone who practices until they can’t get it wrong”. 😊 or, you could say that an ex-spurt is a 'has been that's under pressure'
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Post by scorpiodog on Sept 10, 2020 5:58:39 GMT
That was a really good video, curmudgeon. Quite a few of the ideas I do anyway, but it’s a jolly good, comprehensive guide to performing. I’m so glad you mentioned that there is no need for competitiveness. In so many environments one would think guitar playing is a sport (not here, obvs). Guitarists do seem to be a competitive lot. Thanks for posting this.
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 10, 2020 8:41:36 GMT
I think it is always worth reflecting on what an audience wants. The word authenticity is overdone these days but I'd rather listen to somebody with basic skill singing genuinely wioth passion rather than some posseur pretending to be Pierrre Bensusan. At the end of the day live perfoance is about communication and I have to say scorpiodog I ave always appreciated your performances as you communicate joy and passion rather well!
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Post by robmc on Sept 10, 2020 9:07:59 GMT
Enjoyed your video curmudgeon... so that I can completely dispense with life experience and hard won 'been there done that' knowledge is there an Eau de Curmudgeon available, a couple of quick squirts when needed and away I'd go. Although, I do cringe a little when I'm in an audience and for some reason the act / performer starts signalling me out... but that's just me and is probably why I'm not a great performer! I tend to prefer performers who are little introverted.
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Post by scorpiodog on Sept 10, 2020 9:54:08 GMT
I think it is always worth reflecting on what an audience wants. The word authenticity is overdone these days but I'd rather listen to somebody with basic skill singing genuinely wioth passion rather than some posseur pretending to be Pierrre Bensusan. At the end of the day live perfoance is about communication and I have to say scorpiodog I ave always appreciated your performances as you communicate joy and passion rather well! Thanks, Andy. I always thought it was angst and misery I did well. Nice to think I'm so communicative!
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Post by Matt Milton on Sept 11, 2020 6:35:17 GMT
This has happened to me many many times though not for a while though - mostly in the first year of playing entirely solo. It does seem like something unique to solo playing, which is understandable - when playing solo it's all on you, when playing in a band you are not necessarily playing all the time, you are not on display, and people are unlikely to notice if you make a minor screw-up (perhaps not even your fellow bandmates).
A big imortant thing to remember is that people are listening to your singing more than your playing. (Assuming you're singing and playing guitar?) The song is the thing. If you're singing well and confidently and more importantly with feeling and commitment then nobody will notice or care if you screw up a little in the accompaniment.
I always start with an easy song that I could play in my sleep. Maybe two or three of those if I'm out of practice or feeling a bit tired. I've noticed even mega skilled professionals do this actually. A warm up song. One nice thing about traditional folk clubs is that you can always sing a song entirely a cappella.
I still get really bad anxiety about playing gigs, worst than most people seem to I'd say. Heart thumping, hands shaking, that sort of thing. I try to find some ways of 'releasing it' shortly before I play via some vocal warm ups. Even just clapping exuberantly and some cheers for the support act can help or if it's a folk club singing along with some of the chorus songs beforehand (perhaps a bit too loud!) is a good way of warming up and releasing that anxiety.30 seconds idoing some of those classic singing-teacher warm up arpeggios (tra-la-la, fa-la-la etc) but something as simple as shouting or jumping up and down on the spot kind of seems to work.
Ideally I like to find a quiet space well away from the performance room and run through a couple of songs. How some of the songs start, any tricky parts.
Oh one other thing, if I'm really really getting the jitters I will close my eyes and try to think about what the song means to me. What do the words convey? What do I want the audience to feel about the song? This suddenly makes it all about the song, about telling people something, not about me me me. That helps.
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Post by andyhowell on Sept 11, 2020 7:08:52 GMT
It's very true that it is the singing that people are listening to. YOu can ofen make mistakes or play the wrong chords and people don't seem to notice. Closing eyes and focussing on the song seems a decent idea but you can also think of the oppositite. If you have a song you are comfortable with, or proud of, you will want to communicate it. It sometimes help to visualise your performance filling the whole room. A bit of psycho babble but a technique that is used by both performers and public speakers. Any tiomidity clearly returns the reality that you are not filling the space with personality. Coming back to Paul — scorpiodog — one of the thing about Paul is that he can fill teh space with his personality and that is why he makes a mark on the audience. It's true. I've seen it happen. More than once ;-)
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Post by scorpiodog on Sept 11, 2020 10:27:41 GMT
Cheque's in the post, Andy.
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Post by fuzzbox on Sept 11, 2020 15:58:11 GMT
People that can't play generally can't tell if the bum note was intentional or not. (Unless it was so atonal they are having to reach their hat out of a tree)(Or with difficult jazz, if you actually meant those two consecutive diatonic notes).
However, they can all, clap, tap or sway along, so will have very informed opinions on your rhythm/timing.
Also an audience (usually) want to be entertained, so should be willing you to be any good. (It's only other guitarists that stare intently at your left hand and either nod sagely or raise an eyebrow) It's showbiz that the show must go on, and that's the deal you struck with devil when you strode out on those boards.
Simple stuff, played in time will always be preferable to high stakes improvisation that falls flat on it's face. That, plus a spinning bowtie and a well executed dropping of the trousers never fails.
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