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Post by NikGnashers on Apr 6, 2024 15:01:25 GMT
Just thought this was interesting.
I have never seen one, let along played one. The theory sounds ok, more area for the top/back to resonate, can use thicker wood as it's not being bent, etc.
I would assume it uncomfortable to play, although never tried one (yet).
Thoughts anyone ?
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ocarolan
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Post by ocarolan on Apr 6, 2024 15:51:37 GMT
Intriguing!
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juliant
C.O.G. 
Posts: 430
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Post by juliant on Apr 6, 2024 21:20:05 GMT
Dave Evans used to play a guitar that wasn't a box, but whose sides were flat planes.  He said it made it easier to stand it on the floor. |
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Post by NikGnashers on Apr 7, 2024 4:51:31 GMT
Yes, and Dave actually made that guitar himself too.
This is a better video, which demonstrates the sound :
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Post by Mike Fowler on Apr 7, 2024 9:38:56 GMT
Aside from the aesthetics, I would have thought it was something to do with stability of tension or somesuch.
Things are generally done with easiness in mind, and I would have thought it'd be far more easy to consistently make guitars in a box shape as one could simply reuse the ratio of the dimensions in a more straightforward manner than with the standard curved guitar. Therefore I'm thinking if it's ostensibly easier to make square guitars then there must be some good reason, and not just because it looks nicer, not to.
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Post by NikGnashers on Apr 7, 2024 16:50:46 GMT
Aside from the aesthetics, I would have thought it was something to do with stability of tension or somesuch. Things are generally done with easiness in mind, and I would have thought it'd be far more easy to consistently make guitars in a box shape as one could simply reuse the ratio of the dimensions in a more straightforward manner than with the standard curved guitar. Therefore I'm thinking if it's ostensibly easier to make square guitars then there must be some good reason, and not just because it looks nicer, not to. The explanations in the videos, basically say ... The amount of wood for a rectangular guitar is a lot less than a normal curved one. A dreadnaught sides are something like 36", and the rectangle sides only 22", so they can use wood which is not long enough and would be discarded or used for something else. Also, because a curved guitar needs the wood heating and bending to shape it has to be very thin. For a straight top/bottom, it can be thicker, and thus transmit more of the vibrations to the back, making it vibrate more and thus push more sound out of the hole. And a rectangle has more air in, and more surface area to vibrate as it doesn't have the corners curved off like a normal guitar. It all makes sense, but listening to the audio in the video I posted above, although it does sound pretty good, I can't hear anything special over and above a normal shaped guitar. I just found it interesting, and wanted to share  |
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Post by fred7 on Apr 7, 2024 17:07:56 GMT
I suspect that in the olden days, when guitars were played predominantly by men, they were made with the feminine shape to appeal to men.
In the Martin vs Box guitar video, I thought there was a marked difference in the sound with the Martin ringing out more whilst the square one sounded a bit 'damped'. However, I suspect this is far more to do with the construction rather than the shape. After all, Martin have had a lot more time and R&D to perfect the process.
If the first guy's 5 minute argument (and three second demo) about the increased area of wood being able to vibrate being better, then surely the guitar should be round with the bridge sitting dead centre. But who wants a guitar that looks like a banjo?
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Post by therealmichaelm on Apr 7, 2024 20:36:06 GMT
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Post by malcolm on Apr 8, 2024 12:53:51 GMT
Pure ugly, I wouldn't take one of these as a gift.
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Post by bellyshere on Apr 8, 2024 14:08:42 GMT
It’s hideous. Dave’s squarish one was nice though.
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Post by Onechordtrick on Apr 8, 2024 14:35:56 GMT
Was the original shape of the guitar informed by the violin perhaps?
The biggest drawback to the square guitar to see seems to be it's ergonomics; for a seated player the waist stops the instrument from sliding left or right so I'd imagine one wold need a firmer grip to keep a square one steady.
I don't know what effect the shape of the sound chamber has on the overall tone and volume? The square one had a different tone to the Martin but how much of that was due to the build rather than a flaw in the square concept? A lot more collective experience has gone in the evolution and understanding of how to brace and shape a conventional top compared to other shapes. I'm sure it would be possible to improve the shape of a guitar to optimise both sound and ergonomics but musicians are a conservative bunch (the extremes of electric guitars excepted) so I don't know how commercially successful such an instrument would be
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Post by grayn on Apr 9, 2024 8:21:01 GMT
IMO, they are plug ugly, wouldn't sit on your knee well and despite all the "evidence", it still sounded cheap.
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colins
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Post by colins on Apr 9, 2024 11:00:51 GMT
Don't get me started!  You only have to see the wave patterns on chadlni plates with fixed and unfixed edges to know that the square plate would only work with no sides. With fixed edges a large part of the corner areas will be dead. I could go on, but my blood pressure tells me otherwise. Colin |
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Post by Onechordtrick on Apr 9, 2024 11:32:17 GMT
Apologies for further agitating your blood pressure colins but would that imply that there is an optimal* shape for a guitar body? As a circle has no corners does that mean it would be round? *assuming we could agree on what we mean by optimal... |
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juliant
C.O.G.
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Post by juliant on Apr 9, 2024 20:33:24 GMT
One of these must be pretty much the opposite in all respects. I rather fancied one, back in the day, but he didn't make many. |
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