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Post by borborygmus on Aug 17, 2024 17:11:22 GMT
A dealer called me - they had a guitar just delivered which he said was one of the best he'd ever experienced, and whilst it was already sold, I had to experience this builder's work. I duly dashed down there before it could be delivered to its new owner, and sure enough, it was an absolute delight. Only a few months later, I was at a guitar show, and played this builder's very next instrument. It was a very similar spec to the one I'd already loved, but this one was... well, a dog. This boutique builder is very highly regarded, quite rightly (and a super bloke). I would be happy and keen to look at any other instrument he has made. Soldering fluxes used to be made from naturally occurring resins like pine sap. As the electronics manufacturing industry became more sophisticated and critical, they couldn't tolerate the natural variations in the chemistry of naturally occuring resins, which vary from tree to tree; so they invented synthetic fluxes, such that each batch was the same. Acoustic guitars are made from organic materials, not synthetic. Each piece of wood will have different characteristics, even if they look the same, or even from the same tree. A factory like Lowden will have some processes so that they turn out quite similar instruments each time, but only similar, not the same. Wild Violet's experience illustrates this, albeit maybe an extreme case. Also, guitars change as they age and mature and settle, so one might have to give it a year before coming to judgement  . I have had a number of guitars custom made for me, and you never know how they will turn out. They are all very nice guitars, and I have never sold one. Funnily enough, they are not necessarily my favourite instruments, but I have truly loved the process. So much so that another one has been initiated, build time starting late 2025. Anyway NikGnashers, this is not meant to put you off, but encourage you to follow your muse. There is some risk, of course, but also expectation and excitement. Looking forward to hearing how it all pans out. Peter |
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minorkey
C.O.G. 
On book 3 of the Guitarist's Way, thanks Keith
Posts: 3,642 
My main instrument is: Tanglewood TU13M concert ukulele named Kalea
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Post by minorkey on Aug 17, 2024 18:19:39 GMT
I have a £100 fender acoustic and it sounds great!
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Post by borborygmus on Aug 17, 2024 18:36:14 GMT
I have a £100 fender acoustic and it sounds great! I am sure it does! Does this sound even greater? Peter |
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Post by Vinny on Aug 17, 2024 20:06:17 GMT
Hi NikGnashersI’m a Lowden and Avalon fan. I’ve one Lowden, an O32c and three Avalons. It sounds like you really know what you want and I think it’s unlikely you’ll get to try the F50 you’re after in the spec you want, until you order it, as slim neck Lowdens are like hens’ teeth. All that matters is that it’s what YOU want. I also don’t think you’ll ever get a bad Lowden, unlike you might in more high volume builders. They will vary but I’ve played lots, liked some more than others, but all were very good and consistent. A friend has an F50 in adirondack and Cuban mahogany and it is a wonderful guitar. I certainly prefer it to my O32c, and I really like mine. Good luck with the search. That wood combination is apparently George Lowden’s personal favourite |
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Post by robmc on Aug 17, 2024 20:07:25 GMT
A good guitar is like a cat, the right one will find you.
I have first hand experience of this on three occasions, because I am a lucky git, when it comes to the curvy stringed goddess. Searching one out is not a fool’s errand but it’s quite tricky, in my experience.
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Post by borborygmus on Aug 17, 2024 20:57:58 GMT
I have a £100 fender acoustic and it sounds great! Dave Rawlings, partner of Gillian Welch and Grammy Award winners, achieves his signature guitar sound flatpicking a small archtop guitar. The 1935 Epiphone Olympic that has been his primary instrument was a mid-priced guitar for its time, with a carved arched solid sprucewood top, carved arched solid mahogany back and mahogany sides. It sold for about $35 in 1935, equivalent to $780 in 2023. Whatever floats your boat… Peter |
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minorkey
C.O.G.
On book 3 of the Guitarist's Way, thanks Keith
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Tanglewood TU13M concert ukulele named Kalea
Mini-Profile Background: {"image":"","color":"72dd99"}
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Post by minorkey on Aug 17, 2024 23:40:56 GMT
I have a £100 fender acoustic and it sounds great! I am sure it does! Does this sound even greater? Peter Of course, but then he's an experienced player! I'm sure he could make my cheapo fender sing |
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Post by NikGnashers on Aug 18, 2024 8:20:21 GMT
The thing is Larry, anything expensive follows the path of diminishing returns.
Aside from acoustic guitars, my other passion is cars.
It has taken me decades of buying and selling cars, and a LOT of working hard and saving, for me to be able to own a BMW M2.
Is it 10 times better than another car which costs 10 times less ?
No, of course not, and like your £100 Fender, any working car will do the same job, and 99% of people will say to me 'my car gets me to every place yours does, and we all have to stick to the same speed limits, so what is the point' ....
They have no interest in the delicate chassis balance, the steering feel, or the cornering ability, and thus will simply not understand those finer points which make it much more enjoyable to drive for me personally.
A £100 Fender if it is in good, working condition, will be able to play the same songs as any other similar type of acoustic. A £500 guitar will probably play a lot better and sound significantly better, have a more balanced sound with both more bass and more treble, sustain for longer, and will be better built meaning if something does go wrong it can be, and will be worth, repairing.
A £5000 guitar will not be the same amount of 'better' again, due to the law of diminishing returns, as with anything, the amount of 'better' something is decreases as the price rapidly increases.
It will be better, but by a subtle amount.
Now, if those tiny 'better' differences are not something a player is bothered about, or can even hear, then no, it is completely not worth the expense.
If those tiny and subtle differences are something which ignites the passion to play, and makes you want to play the instrument even more, then why not buy the best you can afford ?
I can't afford a £50,000 guitar, but if I did have that sort of money to spare, then I would consider buying one.
Believe me, £10,000 is a hell of a lot of money to spend, for myself personally, on a hobby. It is not something I take lightly, and this is a serious investment which I am taking months to consider. It will take me another 5 years of hard work to pay it off, but what do I go to work for, to pay the bills and survive ?
No, life is for living, and we are not on this earth for very long. I'd rather not be 80 years old and regret never taking any risk, wishing I had bought that amazing guitar I dreamed about, 25 years previously.
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Post by malcolm on Aug 18, 2024 12:21:25 GMT
I am sure it does! Does this sound even greater? Peter Of course, but then he's an experienced player! I'm sure he could make my cheapo fender sing No he couldn't. If it's not in the guitar, no one can bring it out. |
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Post by malcolm on Aug 18, 2024 12:38:27 GMT
The thing is Larry, anything expensive follows the path of diminishing returns. Aside from acoustic guitars, my other passion is cars. It has taken me decades of buying and selling cars, and a LOT of working hard and saving, for me to be able to own a BMW M2. Is it 10 times better than another car which costs 10 times less ? No, of course not, and like your £100 Fender, any working car will do the same job, and 99% of people will say to me 'my car gets me to every place yours does, and we all have to stick to the same speed limits, so what is the point' .... They have no interest in the delicate chassis balance, the steering feel, or the cornering ability, and thus will simply not understand those finer points which make it much more enjoyable to drive for me personally. A £100 Fender if it is in good, working condition, will be able to play the same songs as any other similar type of acoustic. A £500 guitar will probably play a lot better and sound significantly better, have a more balanced sound with both more bass and more treble, sustain for longer, and will be better built meaning if something does go wrong it can be, and will be worth, repairing. A £5000 guitar will not be the same amount of 'better' again, due to the law of diminishing returns, as with anything, the amount of 'better' something is decreases as the price rapidly increases. It will be better, but by a subtle amount. Now, if those tiny 'better' differences are not something a player is bothered about, or can even hear, then no, it is completely not worth the expense. If those tiny and subtle differences are something which ignites the passion to play, and makes you want to play the instrument even more, then why not buy the best you can afford ? I can't afford a £50,000 guitar, but if I did have that sort of money to spare, then I would consider buying one. Believe me, £10,000 is a hell of a lot of money to spend, for myself personally, on a hobby. It is not something I take lightly, and this is a serious investment which I am taking months to consider. It will take me another 5 years of hard work to pay it off, but what do I go to work for, to pay the bills and survive ? No, life is for living, and we are not on this earth for very long. I'd rather not be 80 years old and regret never taking any risk, wishing I had bought that amazing guitar I dreamed about, 25 years previously. This is a very well thought out post and I understand completely your approach. I think it is perfectly acceptable to spend £10,000 on your dream guitar and I wouldn't hesitate if I was holding it in my hands and could evaluate it properly. However, based on personal experience I can confidently state that ordering an instrument built to your specification can be risky and if it turns out to be not exactly what you hoped for, you will take a big loss when trying to sell it on. Having said that, Lowden are a very reputable company and fairly local, so you are probably safer than you would be with a single luthier or a large American manufacturer. I hope it all turns out well for you. |
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brianr2
C.O.G.
Posts: 3,181
My main instrument is: Fylde Goodfellow
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Post by brianr2 on Aug 18, 2024 15:42:05 GMT
The thing is Larry, anything expensive follows the path of diminishing returns. Aside from acoustic guitars, my other passion is cars. It has taken me decades of buying and selling cars, and a LOT of working hard and saving, for me to be able to own a BMW M2. Is it 10 times better than another car which costs 10 times less ? No, of course not, and like your £100 Fender, any working car will do the same job, and 99% of people will say to me 'my car gets me to every place yours does, and we all have to stick to the same speed limits, so what is the point' .... They have no interest in the delicate chassis balance, the steering feel, or the cornering ability, and thus will simply not understand those finer points which make it much more enjoyable to drive for me personally. A £100 Fender if it is in good, working condition, will be able to play the same songs as any other similar type of acoustic. A £500 guitar will probably play a lot better and sound significantly better, have a more balanced sound with both more bass and more treble, sustain for longer, and will be better built meaning if something does go wrong it can be, and will be worth, repairing. A £5000 guitar will not be the same amount of 'better' again, due to the law of diminishing returns, as with anything, the amount of 'better' something is decreases as the price rapidly increases. It will be better, but by a subtle amount. Now, if those tiny 'better' differences are not something a player is bothered about, or can even hear, then no, it is completely not worth the expense. If those tiny and subtle differences are something which ignites the passion to play, and makes you want to play the instrument even more, then why not buy the best you can afford ? I can't afford a £50,000 guitar, but if I did have that sort of money to spare, then I would consider buying one. Believe me, £10,000 is a hell of a lot of money to spend, for myself personally, on a hobby. It is not something I take lightly, and this is a serious investment which I am taking months to consider. It will take me another 5 years of hard work to pay it off, but what do I go to work for, to pay the bills and survive ? No, life is for living, and we are not on this earth for very long. I'd rather not be 80 years old and regret never taking any risk, wishing I had bought that amazing guitar I dreamed about, 25 years previously. I recently took delivery of a custom Fylde. The process of commissioning a guitar is a joy all of itself. The discussion of needs, solutions and options with someone whose life work such things have been is something special. Even the anticipation while waiting for “your” guitar adds to the process in our world of instant gratification. Yes, there is a risk that your dreams are not fulfilled. But commissioning a guitar is fundamentally a matter of trust and of finding someone with the right track record of success. All in all, this is more a matter of the heart than the head. But I feel truly blessed to have had this opportunity and will carry it - and my beloved Fylde Goodfellow - with me through all my days. |
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Post by borborygmus on Aug 18, 2024 16:02:16 GMT
I recently took delivery of a custom Fylde. The process of commissioning a guitar is a joy all of itself. The discussion of needs, solutions and options with someone whose life work such things have been is something special. Even the anticipation while waiting for “your” guitar adds to the process in our world of instant gratification. Yes, there is a risk that your dreams are not fulfilled. But commissioning a guitar is fundamentally a matter of trust and of finding someone with the right track record of success. All in all, this is more a matter of the heart than the head. But I feel truly blessed to have had this opportunity and will carry it - and my beloved Fylde Goodfellow - with me through all my days. This   |
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Post by earwighoney on Aug 18, 2024 17:34:47 GMT
I have had a number of guitars custom made for me, and you never know how they will turn out. They are all very nice guitars, and I have never sold one. Funnily enough, they are not necessarily my favourite instruments, but I have truly loved the process. So much so that another one has been initiated, build time starting late 2025.
What guitar have you commissioned Bob?
I have a few commissioned guitars and the build process is a really enjoyable thing to participate in. One of my regrets was my commissions were with non English speakers and sometimes things were lost in translation and the custom build process didn't go entirely as I would have liked it to, but I was pleased with my finished instruments nonetheless.
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Post by borborygmus on Aug 18, 2024 17:43:05 GMT
I have had a number of guitars custom made for me, and you never know how they will turn out. They are all very nice guitars, and I have never sold one. Funnily enough, they are not necessarily my favourite instruments, but I have truly loved the process. So much so that another one has been initiated, build time starting late 2025.
What guitar have you commissioned Bob?
I have a few commissioned guitars and the build process is a really enjoyable thing to participate in. One of my regrets was my commissions were with non English speakers and sometimes things were lost in translation and the custom build process didn't go entirely as I would have liked it to, but I was pleased with my finished instruments nonetheless.
I am working with Judson Riviere of Riviere Guitars. Judson is a recently graduated apprentice of Jason Kostal, and I am catching him at the beginning of his building career, when his prices are still quite low! Peter |
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Post by earwighoney on Aug 18, 2024 19:22:38 GMT
What guitar have you commissioned Bob?
I have a few commissioned guitars and the build process is a really enjoyable thing to participate in. One of my regrets was my commissions were with non English speakers and sometimes things were lost in translation and the custom build process didn't go entirely as I would have liked it to, but I was pleased with my finished instruments nonetheless.
I am working with Judson Riviere of Riviere Guitars. Judson is a recently graduated apprentice of Jason Kostal, and I am catching him at the beginning of his building career, when his prices are still quite low! Peter
Thanks for the info, I didn't know of this guy. His work looks great!
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Jo whoever he is.
