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Post by surfguy13 on Mar 31, 2021 11:23:41 GMT
Many thanks Martin, I may well take you up on that offer! It's great to have a view from someone who owns one, you really can't get a better opinion than that. It sounds like it's a real all-rounder as they were designed to be. Huge advantage that it fingerpicks as well as flatpicks. That is not always the case with dreadnoughts. If my metric/imperial conversion is correct that's a little over 1.5"? From what you said about the neck being a modified-V I guess it would be a very good idea to check one out. I wonder what the fingerboard radius is? I have found that Lowdens and the pre-war Collings have a perfect nut width but the fingerboard is very flat indeed. If the neck/fingerboard is modified I wonder if the radius might be slightly greater? From memory the Lowden radius is 16" which for me is a touch flat. I guess my preference would be somewhere between 12"and 14". I may well get back to you if I may as I'm sure I will think of something that it would be useful to know!! Modern Martins are 16". Collings are compound starting at 14" and ending at 26"... I think Gibsons are 12"... Incredibly helpful, thanks so much for confirming these. I am amazed that Martins are 16", they don't feel anything like as flat as, say, Lowdens so it just goes to show that it is not just down to the radius alone. The modern Martins I have played have felt very comfortable so I'm going to forget about radius as it's obviously misleading. Another reason is so important to play it first. Really interesting to know Gibsons are 12" though.........
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Post by vikingblues on Apr 1, 2021 9:23:19 GMT
So often the case that just one factor in a guitar design can't be used as an essential must have for a guitar to feel right! I've been so often taken aback to find what I thought was a must have or a no-no for me in a guitar when trying to get a short list together turned out to be misguided. A guitar with a thin neck feels great, and then one with a similar thin neck feels horrible. Two guitars with similar body dimensions of lower bout and upper bout - one feels comfortable and the other not at all. All solid wood needed on the body - then at random you try a solid top and laminate back and sides that sounds wonderful while an all solid one sounds dull. Two guitars of the same make and model - one sounds really good and the other sucks! I'm glad my GAS is AWOL (and has been for some time) as the lockdowns must make trying to get a new acoustic so much more difficult. This is a useless post as I've no suggestions for an acoustic - sorry! But I'm even useless at giving myself suggestions for a guitar and I know me very well. Good luck anyway. Mark
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Post by jangarrack on Apr 1, 2021 10:12:48 GMT
So often the case that just one factor in a guitar design can't be used as an essential must have for a guitar to feel right! I've been so often taken aback to find what I thought was a must have or a no-no for me in a guitar when trying to get a short list together turned out to be misguided. A guitar with a thin neck feels great, and then one with a similar thin neck feels horrible. Two guitars with similar body dimensions of lower bout and upper bout - one feels comfortable and the other not at all. All solid wood needed on the body - then at random you try a solid top and laminate back and sides that sounds wonderful while an all solid one sounds dull. Two guitars of the same make and model - one sounds really good and the other sucks! I'm glad my GAS is AWOL (and has been for some time) as the lockdowns must make trying to get a new acoustic so much more difficult. This is a useless post as I've no suggestions for an acoustic - sorry! But I'm even useless at giving myself suggestions for a guitar and I know me very well. Good luck anyway. Mark This post is certainly not useless as although the points made may not seem logical, they are certainly true as far as my experience goes. I have been more than pleasantly surprised by guitars I would never normally consider and thoroughly disappointed by some I expected to blow me away. That said, I think higher quality guitars may be less forgiving of poor technique as I find that my own playing sounds much better (to me anyway) on a guitar that may be slightly less responsive. I experience this most noticeably when playing my nylon string Taylor which has does not have the dynamics or response of my classical, although I guess familiarity with the guitar I use the most may also be a factor.
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Post by surfguy13 on Apr 1, 2021 14:18:42 GMT
So often the case that just one factor in a guitar design can't be used as an essential must have for a guitar to feel right! I've been so often taken aback to find what I thought was a must have or a no-no for me in a guitar when trying to get a short list together turned out to be misguided. A guitar with a thin neck feels great, and then one with a similar thin neck feels horrible. Two guitars with similar body dimensions of lower bout and upper bout - one feels comfortable and the other not at all. All solid wood needed on the body - then at random you try a solid top and laminate back and sides that sounds wonderful while an all solid one sounds dull. Two guitars of the same make and model - one sounds really good and the other sucks! I'm glad my GAS is AWOL (and has been for some time) as the lockdowns must make trying to get a new acoustic so much more difficult. This is a useless post as I've no suggestions for an acoustic - sorry! But I'm even useless at giving myself suggestions for a guitar and I know me very well. Good luck anyway. Mark This post is certainly not useless as although the points made may not seem logical, they are certainly true as far as my experience goes. I have been more than pleasantly surprised by guitars I would never normally consider and thoroughly disappointed by some I expected to blow me away. That said, I think higher quality guitars may be less forgiving of poor technique as I find that my own playing sounds much better (to me anyway) on a guitar that may be slightly less responsive. I experience this most noticeably when playing my nylon string Taylor which has does not have the dynamics or response of my classical, although I guess familiarity with the guitar I use the most may also be a factor. Just couldn't agree more with you Mark and likewise jangarrack. Sadly you just never know unless you try. This is the frustration with not being able to go and see/try a guitar or visit a shop. For me neither environment is ideal but you can get a feel for a guitar even if you can't hear it if you're playing in a shop!! You just can't assume that because a guitar has solid woods it will sound great, or sound rubbish if it is constructed with laminates. I guess we are all subject to trends and inevitably can get a little too sucked in to what other people think rather than making your own mind up based on actually playing a guitar. Lockdown is a potential road block where buying a guitar is concerned but bizarrely it may actually be a blessing in some respects as it makes you really consider exactly what it is you want without letting that instant gratification thing get the better of you.
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Post by papadon on Apr 1, 2021 23:03:52 GMT
I picked up Chinese made Guild Westerly series solid wood this year and couldn't be happier. It stands toe to toe with my 72 D40 which both irritates and amazes me to no end. D140CE
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Post by surfguy13 on Apr 2, 2021 6:55:31 GMT
I picked up Chinese made Guild Westerly series solid wood this year and couldn't be happier. It stands toe to toe with my 72 D40 which both irritates and amazes me to no end. D140CE Yes, I was looking at a Chinese Guild the other day, as DS240, and for a dread with solid woods and a hard case it is stupidly cheap. Sadly it is to far away to go and see/try it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2021 13:16:02 GMT
I picked up Chinese made Guild Westerly series solid wood this year and couldn't be happier. It stands toe to toe with my 72 D40 which both irritates and amazes me to no end. On a similar note I bought a Chinese made koa Yamaha AC4K about 4 weeks ago and it's a great guitar. I really like it. If I didn't already have others I'd be more than happy with it as an only guitar.
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Post by vikingblues on Apr 5, 2021 9:07:18 GMT
This post is certainly not useless as although the points made may not seem logical, they are certainly true as far as my experience goes. I have been more than pleasantly surprised by guitars I would never normally consider and thoroughly disappointed by some I expected to blow me away. That said, I think higher quality guitars may be less forgiving of poor technique as I find that my own playing sounds much better (to me anyway) on a guitar that may be slightly less responsive. I experience this most noticeably when playing my nylon string Taylor which has does not have the dynamics or response of my classical, although I guess familiarity with the guitar I use the most may also be a factor. Just couldn't agree more with you Mark and likewise jangarrack . Sadly you just never know unless you try. This is the frustration with not being able to go and see/try a guitar or visit a shop. For me neither environment is ideal but you can get a feel for a guitar even if you can't hear it if you're playing in a shop!! You just can't assume that because a guitar has solid woods it will sound great, or sound rubbish if it is constructed with laminates. I guess we are all subject to trends and inevitably can get a little too sucked in to what other people think rather than making your own mind up based on actually playing a guitar. Lockdown is a potential road block where buying a guitar is concerned but bizarrely it may actually be a blessing in some respects as it makes you really consider exactly what it is you want without letting that instant gratification thing get the better of you. jangarrack, glad my ramblings were of some relevance, and your comment that "higher quality guitars may be less forgiving of poor technique" is absolutely right. I had a bumpy and frustrating journey with a Lowden because of that issue, and it ended with a parting of the ways for us. Great sound, wonderful sustain - but I couldn't control the bugger. Lacking the dexterity to damp a load of notes so they wouldn't clash with new notes being played, the poor guitar got played less and less despite being by far the best quality guitar in my collection and being the nearest to where I would normally be when going to pick up a guitar.
surfguy13 - you're spot on with saying the shop environment often not being ideal for evaluating a guitar for sound. But feel - yes, that's OK! In one of the local guitar shops (no longer in business) there were issues with evaluating sound, not just in having to compete with electric guitars and bass guitars being tested, but also in poor quality old and gungy strings. What became for me the most important test was does the guitar I'm trying encourage me to play and to improvise - that's a guitar that is very likely to be good for me. Whatever the badge and woods.
I found it very easy with a very good guitar to be sidetracked into just listening to the notes and chords and just thinking how lovely it sounds.
Mark
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Post by jangarrack on Apr 5, 2021 9:17:58 GMT
vikingblues "......I found it very easy with a very good guitar to be sidetracked into just listening to the notes and chords and just thinking how lovely it sounds." I hadn't thought of that but it's something I'm definitely guilty of. Jeff
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 13:02:41 GMT
vikingblues "......I found it very easy with a very good guitar to be sidetracked into just listening to the notes and chords and just thinking how lovely it sounds." I hadn't thought of that but it's something I'm definitely guilty of. Jeff Me too. I can play the same four chords round and round for hours and only stop because I start to feel embarrassed the neighbours might hear.
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Post by surfguy13 on Apr 6, 2021 7:42:39 GMT
Just couldn't agree more with you Mark and likewise jangarrack . Sadly you just never know unless you try. This is the frustration with not being able to go and see/try a guitar or visit a shop. For me neither environment is ideal but you can get a feel for a guitar even if you can't hear it if you're playing in a shop!! You just can't assume that because a guitar has solid woods it will sound great, or sound rubbish if it is constructed with laminates. I guess we are all subject to trends and inevitably can get a little too sucked in to what other people think rather than making your own mind up based on actually playing a guitar. Lockdown is a potential road block where buying a guitar is concerned but bizarrely it may actually be a blessing in some respects as it makes you really consider exactly what it is you want without letting that instant gratification thing get the better of you. jangarrack , glad my ramblings were of some relevance, and your comment that "higher quality guitars may be less forgiving of poor technique" is absolutely right. I had a bumpy and frustrating journey with a Lowden because of that issue, and it ended with a parting of the ways for us. Great sound, wonderful sustain - but I couldn't control the bugger. Lacking the dexterity to damp a load of notes so they wouldn't clash with new notes being played, the poor guitar got played less and less despite being by far the best quality guitar in my collection and being the nearest to where I would normally be when going to pick up a guitar.
surfguy13 - you're spot on with saying the shop environment often not being ideal for evaluating a guitar for sound. But feel - yes, that's OK! In one of the local guitar shops (no longer in business) there were issues with evaluating sound, not just in having to compete with electric guitars and bass guitars being tested, but also in poor quality old and gungy strings. What became for me the most important test was does the guitar I'm trying encourage me to play and to improvise - that's a guitar that is very likely to be good for me. Whatever the badge and woods.
I found it very easy with a very good guitar to be sidetracked into just listening to the notes and chords and just thinking how lovely it sounds.
Mark
You're dead right Mark. Feel is just as important as sound. To be honest, even when I have gone to somebody's house (in the distant past!!) to try a guitar the environment is rarely ideal. Having the owner sitting in front of you talking just doesn't make for a good test drive, regardless of how pleasant or accommodating he or she is! I find myself desperately trying to evaluate the guitar at the same time as having a conversation! Even if I am left on my own I never really feel comfortable. However it actually sounds when you're trying it, it will seldom sound the same when you play it in an environment that you are familiar with. But.......whether it feels right is often instinctive and regardless of what distractions there are you will often know quite quickly whether the guitar is going to suit you in terms of body size, scale length and the shape and feel of the neck and frets etc. Also, you can assess condition. I think we all have a mental picture of what different woods will give us so even if you are battling against stairway to heaven at 11 on the other side of the shop you can get a pretty good idea.
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kaydee
Strummer
Posts: 28
My main instrument is: tanglewood TW45VSB
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Post by kaydee on May 9, 2021 8:32:55 GMT
I think the advice given above regarding selecting your new guitar to fit your hearing loss is sound. If you are hearing too much bass and losing the mids and high end then you might want to try guitars which have a lot of top end.I would ,if it was me not be concerned about resale or whether it suits anyone else,most of my playing is only for me so only my ears matter.....to a degree.
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Post by surfguy13 on May 11, 2021 7:13:01 GMT
I think the advice given above regarding selecting your new guitar to fit your hearing loss is sound. If you are hearing too much bass and losing the mids and high end then you might want to try guitars which have a lot of top end.I would ,if it was me not be concerned about resale or whether it suits anyone else,most of my playing is only for me so only my ears matter.....to a degree. Thanks for that kaydee, really appreciate the input. It's not so much that I am hearing too much bass, more that my hearing is above average in that particular range and in so the extent of hearing loss in the treble registers is accentuated. The audiologist described my hearing loss as "moderate to high in the upper frequencies". I agree that a guitar with slightly more top end would be a sensible option and that is why I was determined to go with a spruce top.....cedar might have been a touch too mellow. Likewise I had decided to stick with rosewood for the same reasons but surprisingly have actually bought a guitar with mahogany back and sides! More about that next week when I have had a chance to get to grips with it. You're right, you can't buy a guitar based on whether it will sell should you need to do that but it does come into the equation. This will (probably!) be my only acoustic from here on in so ideally it needs to be all things to all men. I hope I have got it right first time but............................?!
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kaydee
Strummer
Posts: 28
My main instrument is: tanglewood TW45VSB
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Post by kaydee on May 11, 2021 15:52:55 GMT
My pleasure surfguy,I know my hearing is not as sensitive at the higher frequencies as it used to be,I tend to find the sound of smaller bodied guitars much more enjoyable,maybe because they do not produce such a lot of bass,so I can enjoy the other sounds without the muddiness that too much bass brings to the equation. There is a guitar out there which will fit the bill perfectly for you, Just a small point and maybe not one you have thought of.A couple of years back I cut a sound port in my Tanglewood,I realise ports are a contentious subject but I was extremely surprised how the guitar suddenly became both louder and clearer particularly at the top end.(that is only for the player,) it does not affect the sound heard by listeners in front of the guitar. Maybe try a guitar with a sound port,might just help.
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Post by surfguy13 on May 12, 2021 7:38:16 GMT
My pleasure surfguy,I know my hearing is not as sensitive at the higher frequencies as it used to be,I tend to find the sound of smaller bodied guitars much more enjoyable,maybe because they do not produce such a lot of bass,so I can enjoy the other sounds without the muddiness that too much bass brings to the equation. There is a guitar out there which will fit the bill perfectly for you, Just a small point and maybe not one you have thought of.A couple of years back I cut a sound port in my Tanglewood,I realise ports are a contentious subject but I was extremely surprised how the guitar suddenly became both louder and clearer particularly at the top end.(that is only for the player,) it does not affect the sound heard by listeners in front of the guitar. Maybe try a guitar with a sound port,might just help. It's quite strange that you mention sound ports as I was looking at a guitar the other day (can't remember the maker, a US company) that commonly uses sound ports on their guitars, in some cases two quite large ports, and it struck me as being a really excellent idea; particularly if you do have issues with hearing. I love the sound of dreads but I find myself trying to lean further and further over the body to hear what I'm playing as they really do kick the sound out and unlike a small bodied guitar, you are very much behind the sound. A port on the upper shoulder would make a real difference I would imagine. Great to hear that it has worked so well on your Tanglewood. Is it a larger bodied guitar? Yes, totally agree that small bodied guitars kick the sound out and I love the crisp trebles they produce, but I also love deep bass too! Finding that happy compromise is never easy and that is why I have eventually settled on an OM; it has a German spruce top and mahogany back and sides but also has a slightly deeper body than a standard OM so the bass shines through. In the long-term I'm hoping that this guitar will work for me but only time will really tell.
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