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Post by vikingblues on Mar 7, 2016 8:45:27 GMT
Glutton for punishment - that's me. Just signed up for a another free MOOC songwriting course. This time at Berklee. It's free if you opt out of graded assignments. Berklee Song Writing CourseThis one seems more geared up to the creation of lyrics aspect and is presented by Pat Pattison who I see has several songwriting books on the go. I watched a few of his videos that are online at YouTube and felt on the basis of those I might get something from the course. Subjects covered includes Rhyme Schemes, Stressed Syllables and Beats (do I really need more stress! ), Effect of length of lines and number of lines, Stable and Unstable. There are peer review assignments each week which almost put me off enrolling. On a course with no entry requirements, I have difficulty seeing what value they will be. I am certainly not qualified to say anything about how anyone else writes a song. The course length is 7 weeks and they reckon 3-6 hours per week, but as week 1 is very lightweight it's more like 6 weeks. Week 1 is in essence a 6 minute video and general introductory stuff about who they are and what is available. I will report back as to how it goes, and how it compares to the Sheffield Uni MOOC I recently finished. I feel much more out of my depth tackling this - I'm feel I'm much less able to write lyrics than arrange music. At least i can feel pretty anonymous - there's over 2000 participants so far. Mark
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missclarktree
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Post by missclarktree on Mar 7, 2016 8:55:45 GMT
Rather you than me, but I hope it helps with your lyric writing. I thought your lyrics were good on your last song. They fitted the rhythm well, and the idea was something a bit different. You obviously worked hard on the last one so you must know what you're doing . Hope you enjoy it.
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Post by delb0y on Mar 7, 2016 9:18:06 GMT
I tried the Pat Pattinson course and bailed - it got very time-intensive very quickly and I wasn't getting enough out of it to warrant continuing. YMMV of course! :-)
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Post by vikingblues on Mar 7, 2016 20:04:39 GMT
I hope it helps too Alison, as I suspect I'm going to find this a bit painful - not least for my ego! I'm a little worried that this course is going to be too much geared to academia. The Sheffield Uni course to me was much more palatable due to a lot of the instruction / advice being of a practical nature from those who write songs for a living, often on a very instinctive level. Bit worrying that someone as proficient at song writing as you bailed out Derek! I'm hoping that their suggestion of 3-6 hours a week is correct. I can just about manage 6 hours. Week 1 doesn't seem much of a guide of workload as there is hardly anything to it - an even more gentle introduction than that of the Sheffield Uni course. Mark (with the rapidly colder feet)
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Post by delb0y on Mar 7, 2016 20:20:20 GMT
It was very much lyric-based, Mark. When I signed up I was hoping for more about harmony and melody. I did get this song out of it: "Thwarted (Girls Like A Picker)" before I bailed.
Derek
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Post by vikingblues on Mar 7, 2016 23:22:40 GMT
That's a good result for a bail out - nice one Derek! Such a natural style and conversational vocal that speaks directly to the listener. I particularly liked the roundabout gag! I'm fine with it being more lyric based, as the Sheffield Uni course was more geared to harmony and melody and the musical arrangement aspect of a song. I've only got as far as the Introductory Video and one Video on Point of View with a few questions during the video. The quiz following on from that is yet to be tackled. To be done when my brain is sparking on more than one cylinder - i.e. not after 11.00 pm by which time this old timer is sagging somewhat. Mark
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Post by vikingblues on Mar 16, 2016 23:34:30 GMT
I think the way the Berklee / Coursera course is structured / geared up has maybe changed since Derek took the course.
As it stands now if you take the free option (which is what MOOCs are described as usually then you get the video lessons, but not the quizzes or the peer review assignments. As a result there is not really any time pressure at all, and I find myself on week 5 after 2 weeks.
As yet there has not really been much in the sense of songwriting techniques regarding the use of language. In essence we have been told about various tools which can be used to affect the mood of songs and add or remove stability. These tools may be manipulation of line lengths, number of lines, different type and strengths of rhyme, stressed and unstressed syllables, etc.
All rather academic and I do miss the input from professional musicians / songwriters that the Sheffield Uni / FutureLearn course utilised. I have a feeling that these are maybe techniques that become more appropriate further down the line when (IF!) the simple aspects like thinking of words at all are mastered.
I see weeks 6 and 7 have things listed like "Writing the Lines" and "Phrasing" so maybe they will be a bit more skewed to use of language. I will update this thread once I've got to the end.
Mark
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Post by delb0y on Mar 17, 2016 6:43:12 GMT
Indeed, sounds like they've changed it a lot. The peer review were very time consuming (if you wanted to do a decent number and a decent job - not everyone did, of course). I can't recall how long the quizzes took, but I do recall that it was quite structured and you couldn't race ahead.
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Wild Violet
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Post by Wild Violet on Mar 17, 2016 9:06:29 GMT
I started this course a couple of years ago and like Derek, I found it to be pretty intense and at the time, it was too much for me to take on. I bailed after the first couple of weeks. Now that I'm not working at a real job, I'm going to take it again in April and see if I can finish it. I bought Pat's songwriting book for my kindle a few years back and haven't read it yet, either. I can see a distinct pattern here...
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Post by creamburmese on Mar 17, 2016 16:56:52 GMT
Last weekend I got the opportunity to chat with Kim Perlak who is acting chair of guitar at Berklee. She gave some fascinating insights - a lot of cross-genre collaborations go on there (she talked about playing duets with Tommy Emmanuel as a sub for his duo partner when he wasn't around and she played in concert a heartbreaking classical guitar version of Tommy Emmanuels arrangement of Billy Joels "Lullabye" You know how people take up guitar because they hear something really cool and want to learn to play it? I never actually subscribed to that camp, and I"m not constantly asking to play stuff that is light years beyond my ability level - more the converse. However, I now have a "wanna play someday" and it's that classical guitar version of Lullabye. BTW Berklee is considered a powerhouse of guitar instruction in the US - they have over 60 guitar instructors encompassing every possible type of guitar playing - but of course it is heavily academic (and especially so in the classical guitar world) I did one of their free courses once on music history of the Western world - it was quite good and not a lot of pressure - included some classroom videos of actual teaching of music students at Berklee.... can't be bad for free if it's not a total waste of time
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Post by vikingblues on Mar 18, 2016 7:44:31 GMT
I bought Pat's songwriting book for my kindle a few years back and haven't read it yet, either. I can see a distinct pattern here... I have had two of Pat Pattisons songwriting books in my Amazon basket for a few weeks now - just can't persuade myself to move to the checkout stage with them due I think to past problems with books. I had a Sheila Davis book ("The Songwriters Idea book") for several years - despite many dippings into it and it being taken on holiday several times it did not inspired any words of song - eventually made it's way to a charity shop. I've also had a Rikky Rooksby book for even longer - this is more on the arranging side of things but has been equally unsuccessful. I was surprised after the experiences with these how much I got from the Sheffield Uni FutureLearn course. ................... Derek and Lynn - what you have said does confirm that Berklee have changed the set up quite a lot on the course I'm now on. I can see how the peer review aspect would add to the workload - though I can't say I'm sad that it is no longer included. On a course with no entry qualifications I'm not sure peer review is something that appealed to me and it almost put me off the idea of joining the course (I hadn't realised at that point it was not part of the free course). I certainly don't feel any right or that I have enough knowledge to critique or review anyone elses songwriting skills. You're right Julie - it's remarkable that it is for free. In that sense if I can get anything from it at all it is a worthwhile experience - and I think I am getting something from it. I can only assume they feel the spin off from people taking further paid courses or buying the books they have written makes it worthwhile. Mark
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Post by vikingblues on Mar 19, 2016 19:51:27 GMT
BRAIN MELTDOWN Grammar. Stressed and Unstressed Syllables. Loads of stuff about preposition, pronouns, and all their little friends. Thankfully not having to do the quizzes and the peer group reviews I can just push on in the hope that something I understand and doesn't make me feel the need for a pillow and a good sleep crops up. Or I'd now be bailing. Mark
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