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Post by scorpiodog on Oct 6, 2016 10:31:31 GMT
My local folk club community has a facebook page and there's been an interesting discussion there for the last 24 hours or so. One of the local folkies (who is a member here, I think, so if you see this, Peter, join in please) has asked why the non-playing audiences at our local folk clubs are falling and asks whether folk music and folk clubs have had their day in the UK. There's been a pretty lively discussion and the points include: Young people don't go to folk clubs because they're full of bearded, fair isle jumper wearing, pipe smoking, old people (and that's only the women! ); Ukulele groups are taking over the whole scene; Clubs need to be amplified to make them appealing; Folk music has had its day and other things are occupying peoples' attention; The question has been asked about how often the singaround club performers go to other clubs just to listen if they're not performing; There are too many clubs in the area and not enough audience to go around;and There's also the other point of view summed up by: "our club's all right. We have millions of people in the audience of all ages, shapes and states of rasage." All of this stuff is in my words. I can't post a link because it's a closed facebook group. So, have we an opinion on this forum? What are your experiences in your local area? Do young and old folkies mix where you are? If so, how do you arrange for this to happen? Is the folk club a thing of the past?
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Martin
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Post by Martin on Oct 6, 2016 10:45:31 GMT
My local folk (ahem...ACOUSTIC MUSIC) club seems to be thriving. It suffered a forced move of venue (again) just last year from the pub to the Booling (bowling) Club. This actually resulted in a bigger space for the group, and there are now more attendees than ever. Granted, the busiest nights seem to be 'singers' nights' when the performers can bring their guitars and show off, but it is not in decline. This has been partially assisted by the taking over of the admin and promotion of the club by new-ish faces who actively promote the club, it's line-ups and events on the website and Facebook, engaging with members and attendees. Age-wise, it's still full of coffin-dodgers, and I'm one of the youngest, but most of them can still walk unassisted, so that seems fine
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Post by walkingdecay on Oct 6, 2016 11:00:39 GMT
There may be a revival of old style folk clubs in the future, but my experience suggests that the dying-off of old codgers like me will help.
The clubs local to me are almost exclusively populated and run by grey groaners, and the cliquish nature of them is worse than it's ever been. I see youngsters come in sometimes and wonder what they make of the long between-numbers conversations between the compere and his mate on the front row, the complete lack of professionalism that falls well below charming and amounts to chaos, the same songs being performed twice or more on the same night and so on. Oh, and dare I mention the bloody awful floor singers who are endured rather than enjoyed every week? Why don't they understand that they're terrible and simply can't entertain anyone? I do.
The youngsters rarely go back, and I'm not sure why I do, unless there's some fixed migratory pattern I can't break out of.
I suppose and hope that there are better and more exciting clubs out there, but the ones I know are where old denim goes to decay. Fortunately folk music is so strong that no one can actually break it, so there is hope.
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leitrimnick
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Post by leitrimnick on Oct 6, 2016 11:30:53 GMT
Folk clubs...what folk clubs? There are some acoustic open mics in Sligo (18 miles away) which all start around 22:00, apart from that there are Trad sessions but these exist in a parallel universe (I'm afraid you may have to be a Blow-In here to understand that). As far as I know there is no formal folk, blues or acoustic music club in the Sligo/Leitrim area...I hope to be corrected. There is a tradition in the West of Ireland that music starts late and is provided free.
I fear the demise of the folk club, as known by a younger version of my old fart self, may be unstoppable. I sincerely hope not, but I suspect the evolve or become extinct rule will apply.
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Post by missclarktree on Oct 6, 2016 13:26:38 GMT
Me and the Respectable Gentleman have made it as far as the doorway of two folk venues - I'm not sure if they were clubs but I believe there is a lot of that sort of thing going on in Morecambe. We didn't go inside because of the excessive volume of amplified guitars. It was positively painful, and I can't see folk clubs surviving if they're all like that.
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 6, 2016 13:29:16 GMT
I have one of the Country's 'show clubs' near me, The Red Lion. I have been going here for many, many, years but it's all getting a bit sad now.
A lot of those who used to play there now play a smaller bar venue nearby. They don't have to follow the folk club format or share the door money. The organisers are very traditional folkie people. They have tried hard and when they took over the cub they embarked on a more diverse booking policy that focussed on you get talent. But the whole things dated now.
I do find this very Sad though. We have lots of menu venues and clubs near me but very few where people can begin to process into a higher plane.
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Post by ocarolan on Oct 6, 2016 14:15:10 GMT
No "proper" folk clubs in my immediate area. A fair number of "Open Mikes" though, or, if they are trying to sound different, "Acoustic Nights" - the latter all being very plugged in and operated as per Open Mics. Occasional tune sessions (used to run one) here and there, though these, by their very nature, are primarily for the amusement of the players. There are one or two opportunities fo singaround type gatherings, but as these all a car journey away, and Mrs O'C is not a huge fan of traipsing round pubs with me as driver purely so I can play and sing. I started off in my teens in the 1960s in a proper folk club - upstairs room in a pub, no amplification, people listened, pro guest most weeks supported by regulars, floor singers only approx once a month. It was a very supportive place in which to take those first uncertain steps in public performance. This was run by and supported largely by teens, twenties and thirties - just the people who, some 50 years on, are now lamenting the demise of such clubs. I'm sure they still exist in some places - wish there were more. Things go in cycles, and no doubt something of the sort will come back into vogue at some stage, probably when us COGs are dead or too old to participate any more. Keith
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Post by sweyne1 on Oct 6, 2016 16:15:43 GMT
'Teens in the 1960's' means i'm about your age Keith. I find it very strange that nowadays very few youngsters that I know of want to play instruments of any kind. My son (33) has about 30/40 friends in the local area he's known since he was 5 years old. When I was young, if i'd had 40 friends ( half of them or more would have played an instrument and there'd be probably 3/4 bands just out of that bunch (mostly electric perhaps but there was huge interest in playing - not now). As you say, things do go in cycles and, hopefully, when X factor and other such crap dies a very welcome death youngsters may go back to actually making the effort to play again and the acoustic ones will join or start a folk club. Hopefully. John
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Post by davewhite on Oct 6, 2016 17:59:10 GMT
There's always "The Plucky Duck"
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Post by ianlp59 on Oct 6, 2016 19:33:11 GMT
On the whole, I think there probably is a future for folk clubs...mainly predicated on the basis that they still exist...
Here, where I live, I could go out and play probably around four days a week, so many do we have in the vicinity - IF the mood took me. However, all of these venues are frequented by the local folk mafia, for whom variety is definitely not the spice of life, or music, for that matter.
Scorpiodog and I have played on several occasions at one of my local folk clubs in the past, which, like most clubs, attracts a wide spectrum of wildly differing musical abilities. He will, no doubt, have fond memories of the Catatonic Concertina Player and his other half...along of course with others, such as the OTHER concertina player...
Anyway, for my part, I really like playing music. I have been, in the recent past, fantastically fortunate to share a stage with a seriously iconic character in the folk world and, on two occasions, with one of his relatives. This has come about, not so much as a result of my own modest abilities, but for the fact that I've got to know some wonderful people along the way, in a manner of speaking.
However, all that said, I tend to keep myself to myself. I'm not particularly interested in sitting through an entire evening of largely hopeless performances by people who can't even be bothered to make the effort learn their material before turning up and torturing the rest of us. There are a whole bunch of people who frankly should not be allowed out of their abodes armed with a musical instrument of any description, along of course with the mandatory stand and sheet lyrics. Then there is the street poet who turns up at the last moment and, minutes before his/her performance, is seen still scribbling frantically the last wailing stanzas of the nightmare that awaits the rest of us.
This is why I tend to stay at home...
Love and best to you all,
Ian
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Post by andyhowell on Oct 6, 2016 21:18:37 GMT
On the whole, I think there probably is a future for folk clubs...mainly predicated on the basis that they still exist... Here, where I live, I could go out and play probably around four days a week, so many do we have in the vicinity - IF the mood took me. However, all of these venues are frequented by the local folk mafia, for whom variety is definitely not the spice of life, or music, for that matter. Scorpiodog and I have played on several occasions at one of my local folk clubs in the past, which, like most clubs, attracts a wide spectrum of wildly differing musical abilities. He will, no doubt, have fond memories of the Catatonic Concertina Player and his other half...along of course with others, such as the OTHER concertina player... Anyway, for my part, I really like playing music. I have been, in the recent past, fantastically fortunate to share a stage with a seriously iconic character in the folk world and, on two occasions, with one of his relatives. This has come about, not so much as a result of my own modest abilities, but for the fact that I've got to know some wonderful people along the way, in a manner of speaking. However, all that said, I tend to keep myself to myself. I'm not particularly interested in sitting through an entire evening of largely hopeless performances by people who can't even be bothered to make the effort learn their material before turning up and torturing the rest of us. There are a whole bunch of people who frankly should not be allowed out of their abodes armed with a musical instrument of any description, along of course with the mandatory stand and sheet lyrics. Then there is the street poet who turns up at the last moment and, minutes before his/her performance, is seen still scribbling frantically the last wailing stanzas of the nightmare that awaits the rest of us. This is why I tend to stay at home... Love and best to you all, Ian Tolerance Ian ;-)
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Post by dreadnought28 on Oct 6, 2016 22:50:24 GMT
Backing up the points made by Ian, the fall off in audiences has a lot to do with what now seems to be the average "folk club". That is a circle of 20-30 people of very mixed abilities, often complete with music stands because they can't be bothered to learn the words of the songs they are attempting to perform. Almost everyone picks a very long song so that they get maximum exposure and everybody is focussed on how fast the circle moves so they get another go and not on anybody else's performance. Who in their right mind who is not participating would want to sit through two or three hours of this?
I fell in love with folk music and folk clubs before I became a performer and the clubs I attended had good and very well rehearsed floor singers who knew how to entertain an audience and saw that as as the primary objective. Guests were only once a month or so. Anyone turning up with a music stand would have been laughed at but I got a lot of encouragement and free guitar lessons that really were massive to me in my development.
The attitude of many of those who turn up to "club" nights is, frankly, selfish, and best illustrated by the low attendances on guest nights as the "regulars" think they won't get to play so don't bother turning up.
If I ever run a folk club I'll call it "The No Music Stand Folk Club". Rehearsed and fully prepared floor singers welcome with preference given to those who support the club on guest nights.
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Post by ourmaninthenorth on Oct 6, 2016 23:13:10 GMT
I've always considered myself something of a folk singer.. Why only this evening I burst forth into song to be greeted by my Good Lady saying " Oh Folk..." Boom Boom...I'll get me coat....
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Post by Martin on Oct 6, 2016 23:54:52 GMT
I've always considered myself something of a folk singer.. Why only this evening I burst forth into song to be greeted by my Good Lady saying " Oh Folk..." Boom Boom...I'll get me coat....
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Post by leoroberts on Oct 7, 2016 7:55:12 GMT
There are a whole bunch of people who frankly should not be allowed out of their abodes armed with a musical instrument of any description, along of course with the mandatory stand and sheet lyrics. Then there is the street poet who turns up at the last moment and, minutes before his/her performance, is seen still scribbling frantically the last wailing stanzas of the nightmare that awaits the rest of us. That's why I don't play out... not because I despise those performers - but because I am one
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