Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642 
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 19, 2017 14:29:33 GMT
I have a Fishman Solo amp SA220 that has been great in the pubs, small halls and folk clubs that I've played at so far. When I've played at larger venues, it's mainly been with other artists on the bill and the venue has had their own soundman and a big PA set up. I'm wondering how far the SA220 can take me - for instance would it work in a large village hall filled with people? If not, could I add powered speakers or ? Should I start looking for something else for larger spaces?
I don't want to turn up somewhere for a gig and find that either the SA220 isn't powerful enough or turn it so high that it starts to have feedback...
Thanks for any advice!
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Post by scorpiodog on Jan 19, 2017 15:32:28 GMT
We use our Bose L1 model 2 in some reasonably big rooms (sort of village hall sized or even barn sized). It's rated (we think) about 450 watts, so your 200 watt amp should be only 10% or so quieter. We rarely turn ours up beyond 7 (out of 10, not 11). We did have one occasion in a local concert hall where the Bose wasn't man enough and we had to use a supplementary pa, but that was mainly to to with the spread from the Bose speaker tower (it's a 130 degree angle, and we had tables in the corners by the stage that were in the shadow).
I think it'd largely depend on how well behaved your audience is.
As I understand it, feedback is more a matter of placement of devices likely to feed back than it is about volume. If you stick a mic right in front of the speaker array, you'll feed back at low volume levels. At an extreme, you should have the speakers forward of you towards the audience, but I'd guess that, like the Bose, your rig is fairly feedback resistant anyway.
The only way to find out is to try it.
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Post by andyhowell on Jan 24, 2017 18:44:39 GMT
I think you would struggle in a large village hall especially if the audience wan not quiet as Paul pointed out.
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Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 24, 2017 20:45:26 GMT
Thanks, both! Just wondering now if powered speakers would work or if an entire new PA is the way to go...
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Post by andyhowell on Jan 25, 2017 11:11:47 GMT
It all depends on how late the hall is but I guess a larger hall fall of people would be really pushing it.
I hesitate to respond to the rest of the post as it takes us into gear !!!
Paul's BOSE PA would almost certainly work in a larger hall but there are other options. These days powered speakers are more or less the norm, you will need mixing desk though — although you don't need anything that elaborate you have to think about how many inputs you need. And if it is a decent hall you also get into the land of monitors!
I would find a decent and local store and go and talk to them. DO NOT buy anything on the spot — these sales people can cause chaos. A friend of mine is always coming back with stuff thetis either over powered or not what she needs (not cheap of course).
A PA is a very useful thing to have — I used to have one and was amazed at how oftenI used it. However, it is an expensive option if it is one for casual use.
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Post by MartinS on Jan 25, 2017 20:03:47 GMT
I've absolutely no experience of these type of systems (mini-line array), but I also doubt it would be sufficient for a medium size hall, unless everyone was silent! People are pretty noisy in my experience.
Just a suggestion, but you might consider renting a small PA plus sound guy as required. If you only very rarely need it, it saves a big capital outlay. You get the comfort of a guy setting it up for you, and working the sound during the performance. You might find you have the choice of a few local folk who could provide this service fairly cheaply.
m.
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Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 25, 2017 22:29:39 GMT
Thanks for the advice!
Martin, there is a local guy who has a great PA and is one of the best sound guys I've heard. I was actually going to ask his advice about the Fishman as well, but I think hiring him would definitely be the way to go until I can afford to buy my own, that's a great idea. If it wasn't too far, he'd prob do it for quite a decent price. I'd hate to be paid £250 for a gig and have to spend £150 or more renting a PA and sound guy...
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Riverman
Artist / Performer
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Post by Riverman on Jan 25, 2017 23:11:56 GMT
I'd hate to be paid £250 for a gig Yeah, me too...  |
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Post by andyhowell on Jan 26, 2017 10:44:11 GMT
The renting option was one that I was going to suggest. If you have a good relationship with a store they might let it out without a sound guy.
Getting a group to collectively buy a PA is not a bad idea. Finding someone rich enough to buy one and share one is an even better idea, if a little difficult.
I gave up running a club years ago for a number of reasons. At the end of the day I could just about cope with not knowing whether the place would be rammed or near empty but I really couldn't hack lugging the PA around.
That being said if I had a windfall from something (I keep promoting songs to Nashville) I would go out and buy a decent PA and mixing desk. But I won't get a windfall. And so I won't be doing that!
One final consideration, and I know it doesn't help. For the kinds of space we are talking about you will need not only a decent and reliable PA but one which is built like a tank — the same i probably true with a mixing desk. All of the £s add up :-(
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Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 26, 2017 16:24:57 GMT
I think sharing a PA would cause a lot of friction between friends. I like the idea of it (similar to The Library of Things) but most that I know tend to gig on a Fri/Sat/Sun so I could see there being issues with gigs being on the same night. One thing that's great about the Fishman is it packs up small and is very easy to set up and move around. The Line6 L3T has a reputation for being similar to the Fishman but far more powerful. The unit weighs about 30kg so it's not as easy to lug around or get up on a stand. I really don't want to have to haul around a bunch of big heavy equipment, and I don't want to have to buy a bigger car to be able to fit it all in. The Fishman really is ideal in this aspect. The band I'm in uses the LF Maui system and powered speakers, I really dislike it. The sound is very thin and tinny, no matter what adjustments are made with the mixer. The similar Bose systems sound much better to my ear, and the Line6 better overall. If anyone knows of a similar system to the Fishman but more powerful (aside from the Line6 L3T), please reply about it on this thread! Maybe once I have some money saved I'll try out the Line6 and keep the Fishman for smaller venues, or sell it and put the money towards paying for the Line6. With the mixer it's around £2000, so far from cheap. I'll still check with my sound guy friend in case he knows of a better option. I'd hate to be paid £250 for a gig Yeah, me too... I'm surprised you're not getting more than that already, Mr Knott! Out of interest, what PA are you using? |
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ocarolan
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Post by ocarolan on Jan 26, 2017 16:33:15 GMT
Of course, you could only accept gigs you know the Fishman will cope with. It seems to work well for you in almost all respects, and any serious improvement is going to soak up a lot of gig income....
Keith
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Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 26, 2017 17:13:36 GMT
That's what I've been doing so far Keith, but I want to get in with the Rural Touring Scheme and sometimes the village halls are quite large and often full. I won't be spending any money unnecessarily or earlier than I need to, but if I were able to get on the scheme in several different counties, it wouldn't be too long before the PA money was back in my bank account. I was just hoping there was some way that the Fishman could cope, as it is such a nice set-up.
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Post by ocarolan on Jan 26, 2017 18:48:15 GMT
Sounds good Lynn...I might be tempted to double up on the Fishmans ... use two and play the halls across the narrow dimension rather than trying to reach right to the back along the longest dimension. Is that understandable or confusing?!
Then you still have the option of your existing setup for smaller gigs.
Keith
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Wild Violet
Artist / Performer
Posts: 3,642
My main instrument is: Symonds OM-14
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Post by Wild Violet on Jan 26, 2017 19:08:17 GMT
I like that idea a lot Keith, forgive me but I am not very knowledgeable about sound equip, watts, etc. Would two solo amps mean twice the power? Two louder so to speak?  It certainly would be a cheaper option than the Line6. |
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Riverman
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Post by Riverman on Jan 26, 2017 19:14:55 GMT
Yeah, me too... I'm surprised you're not getting more than that already, Mr Knott! Out of interest, what PA are you using?Lynn, I wish!  I don't have my own PA, I rely on whatever the venue has. Of course that invariably puts you at the mercy of whoever's operating it - and whether they actually understand how an acoustic guitar is meant to sound, not to mention whether they have a clue what vocals sound like without the reverb cranked up to 11... The only time I've actually needed to supply my own sound reinforcement was a cafe gig, where I put both guitar and vocals through my Roland AC-60. It was fine for a small room. I've considered the Fishman, or the Bose L1 Compact, but can't really justify the expense. And I suspect, as you appear to have found, that the more versatility you need, the more you're going to have to shell out. |
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Jo whoever he is.
